Information I'd love to know

roseandheather wrote:

Annachie wrote:Multiple full term pregnancies are far more likely to cause problems than multiple abortions. By a long way.

But if the women are easily replacable things why would he care?

Correction: multiple correctly performed abortions are far less likely to cause problems than multiple full-term pregnancies.

Let's just say my faith that Masada has anything of the kind is rather low.

cthia wrote:If Elizabeth somehow finds herself a widow and she remarries, does textev explicitly state that it simply has to be a commoner, or should be a commoner?

If she falls in love with an uncommoner( ) is she just SOL?

Can she just elect to not marry? That way, she can just have a live-in uncommoner lover. Although that in itself, could be considered quite common.

And, is it explicitly stated that it has to be a Manticoran commoner? Can she marry a commoner from Dresden, Haven, Grayson. Even an Andermani?

Is there a Mrs. Gustav Anderman? I can't seem to find any reference. Is he a widower?

Can she marry a female commoner?

Jonathan_S wrote:But I guess it's possible that that constitutional restriction only says 'heir', not 'monarch and/or heir'. So depending on exactly how it's worded its possible that the restriction might not apply after your crowned. (Personally though I doubt they left that loophole, because it would allow an heir to circumvent the requirement simply by postponing marriage until after they assumed the crown)

Jonathan_S wrote:

cthia wrote:If Elizabeth somehow finds herself a widow and she remarries, does textev explicitly state that it simply has to be a commoner, or should be a commoner?

If she falls in love with an uncommoner( ) is she just SOL?

Can she just elect to not marry? That way, she can just have a live-in uncommoner lover. Although that in itself, could be considered quite common.

And, is it explicitly stated that it has to be a Manticoran commoner? Can she marry a commoner from Dresden, Haven, Grayson. Even an Andermani?

Is there a Mrs. Gustav Anderman? I can't seem to find any reference. Is he a widower?

Can she marry a female commoner?

I can't recall any specific text-ev on remarrage. I suspect the wording is generic enough that any marrage or remarrage of the primary heir would have to be to a commoner.

But I guess it's possible that that constitutional restriction only says 'heir', not 'monarch and/or heir'. So depending on exactly how it's worded its possible that the restriction might not apply after your crowned. (Personally though I doubt they left that loophole, because it would allow an heir to circumvent the requirement simply by postponing marriage until after they assumed the crown)


I couldn't even speculate on how the constitution (or court decisions on it) have effective defined "commoner"


But I absolutely assume that, like any Manticoran, the King, Queen, or primary heir is free to marry someone (or ones) of either sex. (Though whether the Winton's particular branch of Christianity is happy their congregants being in multi-partner marriages is a different question)

SWM wrote:

Jonathan_S wrote:
But I guess it's possible that that constitutional restriction only says 'heir', not 'monarch and/or heir'. So depending on exactly how it's worded its possible that the restriction might not apply after your crowned. (Personally though I doubt they left that loophole, because it would allow an heir to circumvent the requirement simply by postponing marriage until after they assumed the crown)

Alternatively, it might simply require the heir to be married before attaining the crown.

cthia wrote:

SWM wrote:Alternatively, it might simply require the heir to be married before attaining the crown.

Requiring marriage before crowning begs to be susceptible to a crisis reminiscent of Emily-White Haven-Honor and at some point may warrant a shotgun wedding of sorts, that may not be at all good for the crown. The heir may not even be dating anyone, or even old enough to, let alone be in love.

SWM wrote:Possibly but, on the other hand, requiring the heir to be married before attaining the crown is a big step toward ensuring the succession. Also, heirs are already expected to avoid situations which would result in the kind of crisis or shotgun wedding that you are talking about. An heir that would get into such a situation might not be fit for the crown. A requirement of marriage is hardly unprecedented, at least in literature (I don't know whether any real monarchies had such a requirement).

Jonathan_S wrote:

SWM wrote:
Possibly but, on the other hand, requiring the heir to be married before attaining the crown is a big step toward ensuring the succession. Also, heirs are already expected to avoid situations which would result in the kind of crisis or shotgun wedding that you are talking about. An heir that would get into such a situation might not be fit for the crown. A requirement of marriage is hardly unprecedented, at least in literature (I don't know whether any real monarchies had such a requirement).

Well they could avoid a "classic" knocked up the bride shotgun wedding. But a requirement to marry before being crowned could still result in a hasty marrage.

At it would take is for the heir to still be a kid and the current monarch dies. Now the kid has to be crowned (admittedly with a regency council providing guidance until they're of age) -- but with a requirement to be married before being crowned now this kid has to get married.

That's problematic if we're talking a teenager who might actually have a boyfriend or girlfriend at the moment. Its even worse if you're talking about someone less than 12 who isn't even interested yet. How do they (or their guardians) quickly pick a reasonable commoner to marry.


If they had such a requirement I really hope it's got a clause that, for a minor, postpones the requirement to be married from "before being crowned" until "before achieving their majority;" (when they'd no longer be under the guidance of their regency council)

But I really doubt they have a law requiring the heir to be married before assuming the crown.

cthia wrote:Underage assumption of the crown isn't at all unprecedented in literature either. I suddenly fear arranged marriages.

At any rate, what came first for Elizabeth? The chicken (husband) or the egg (crown.)

World of Honor: Queen's Gambit wrote:Elizabeth rubbed her hands over her eyes. "By Manticoran law, I must have a regent until I'm twenty-one T-years. Since I'm past my sixteenth birthday, they can't foist just anyone on me. I nominate my regent; Parliament confirms or rejects my choice. We do this until we're both happy. I suspect it could be an ugly time."
She sat in thoughtful silence for a moment, then, twisting in his lap to face him, she twinkled.
"Then there will be the question of our marriage."
Justin felt a sudden, cold fear that somehow Elizabeth would be taken from him. They had been engaged with King Roger and Queen Angelique's full approval since soon after Elizabeth's seventeenth birthday. Could Parliament force Elizabeth to break the engagement, choose another spouse?
"Question?" he squeaked.
This time Ariel's reproving bleek was for both of them—Justin for doubting Elizabeth, and Elizabeth for her choice of a joke. The treecat rose and patted Justin on the side of his face, his other true-hand resting on Elizabeth's shoulder.
"I shouldn't tease," Elizabeth admitted ruefully. "Justin, no one can make me break my engagement with you. I don't even expect it to be questioned. However, the line of succession has just grown shorter by one. Originally, we planned to marry after I turned twenty-one, right?"
"Right," he answered, his voice back to normal.
"Now I expect there will be some pressure for us to marry sooner."
"I don't have a problem with that."
"Nor I, particularly," she said, "but there will be those who do. Some will think a proper mourning period should be observed. Others will worry that the distractions of a wedding, a husband, pressure to produce an heir, will distract me from my duties as Queen."
"So they'll want you to wait."
"Exactly. After all, there are the cadet branches of the House. My Aunt Caitrin and her children can carry on if something happens both to me and to Michael before I have children of my own. . . ."
Her voice trailed off. Small and forlorn, she leaned her head back against his shoulder, tears trailing down her face.
"Justin, I don't want to think about it!"
"Then don't," Justin suggested, "for right now. Don't think about anything at all."