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McQueen vs Pritchart

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Re: McQueen vs Pritchart
Post by Jonathan_S   » Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:39 pm

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drothgery wrote:I never get that far, because it's pretty nearly certain if McQueen's coup is successful, she never authorizes the assassination attempt on Elizabeth and Benjamin (she doesn't know about the plan, and would almost certainly be even more ideologically opposed to it than Pierre was if she did). Which means the Cromarty government presses the first war to Haven's surrender (which happens more quickly under McQueen because she has a much better grasp of military realities).

Because there's no High Ridge government
- the Lynx terminus is not discovered as quickly
- Manticore resolves the situation on and around Congo, almost certainly in a very different fashion than Victor Cachat & co. did (and Erewhon remains allied with Manticore)
- The Andies press their claims in Silesia openly, and some sort of reasonable resolution is reached
Of course the other possibility for McQueen's continued survival is that she doesn't erroneously suspect St. Just has ordered her arrest and execution, so doesn't jump the gun. Given how little time there is left before Buttercup, she might well have not executed her coupe attempt by then, allowing her to continue as Minister of War under Pierre.

Now whether Pierre would authorize the assassination attempts after Buttercup kicks off is hard to say.

But even if he does, without the fig-leaf of a new Peep government I'm not sure even a High Ridge can politically survive halting the war on the brink of total victory. So even in this scenario McQueen can't militarily save them and it's unlikely to politics would work out the same way.


I just don't see any plausible way to put McQeen in charge with the resources and preconditions necessary for Thunderbolt or Beatrice.
(Maybe, maybe, a Treaty of Versailles scenario where she survives the Peep surrender and then post-war somehow a Mantie government manages to lose the peace; but that seems pretty unlikely on a couple fronts)
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Re: McQueen vs Pritchart
Post by Commodore Oakius   » Wed Sep 03, 2014 4:06 pm

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Jonathan_S wrote:I just don't see any plausible way to put McQeen in charge with the resources and preconditions necessary for Thunderbolt or Beatrice.


I am pretty much agreed. Buttercup was too far into the works to be short stopped. The only hope she had is if it was pre- operation hassain, which, if she wasn't ready after, then she wouldn't have been before.
Had she been able to pull it off she might have been able to convince Cromarty that she wanted to end the fighting, which would have resulted in a surrender by default, but she would have done it, I think so anyway, to solidify her power and rebuild.
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Re: McQueen vs Pritchart
Post by kzt   » Wed Sep 03, 2014 4:34 pm

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drothgery wrote:But even if he does, without the fig-leaf of a new Peep government I'm not sure even a High Ridge can politically survive halting the war on the brink of total victory. So even in this scenario McQueen can't militarily save them and it's unlikely to politics would work out the same way.

Umm, but he did.
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Re: McQueen vs Pritchart
Post by Weird Harold   » Wed Sep 03, 2014 4:38 pm

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kzt wrote:
drothgery wrote:But even if he does, without the fig-leaf of a new Peep government I'm not sure even a High Ridge can politically survive halting the war on the brink of total victory. So even in this scenario McQueen can't militarily save them and it's unlikely to politics would work out the same way.

Umm, but he did.


Yes he did -- WITH the fig-leaf of a new Peep Government after McQueen's failed coup and Pierre's death.
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Re: McQueen vs Pritchart
Post by kzt   » Wed Sep 03, 2014 4:41 pm

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Weird Harold wrote:
kzt wrote:Umm, but he did.


Yes he did -- WITH the fig-leaf of a new Peep Government after McQueen's failed coup and Pierre's death.

St Just was hardly running "a new Peep Government".
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Re: McQueen vs Pritchart
Post by drothgery   » Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:12 pm

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kzt wrote:
drothgery wrote:But even if he does, without the fig-leaf of a new Peep government I'm not sure even a High Ridge can politically survive halting the war on the brink of total victory. So even in this scenario McQueen can't militarily save them and it's unlikely to politics would work out the same way.

Umm, but he did.

Err. that was Jonathan_S, not me.
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Re: McQueen vs Pritchart
Post by kzt   » Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:14 pm

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drothgery wrote:Err. that was Jonathan_S, not me.

Sorry.
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Re: McQueen vs Pritchart
Post by Weird Harold   » Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:25 pm

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kzt wrote:St Just was hardly running "a new Peep Government".


Hence the term "Fig leaf." :roll:
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Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
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Re: McQueen vs Pritchart
Post by Roguevictory   » Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:02 pm

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Weird Harold wrote:
kzt wrote:St Just was hardly running "a new Peep Government".


Hence the term "Fig leaf." :roll:


McQueen running the PRH would be a much more substantial fig leaf then St. Just had.
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Re: McQueen vs Pritchart
Post by drothgery   » Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:30 pm

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Roguevictory wrote:McQueen running the PRH would be a much more substantial fig leaf then St. Just had.
The scenario he was positing was McQueen does not launch her coup early, so Pierre is still around.
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