Ebola Virus

I gotta say again, just to be clear. I am not remotely a 'doomsdaty prepper', nor would I be even if I was 30 and rich enough to buy all that stuff without sacrificing anything more fun or short term useful. I don't want to live like that. I don't care about surviving any true end of civilization stuff. Let me outta here would be my wish should that sort of thing ever happen. Ok?

But much lesser crap does happen; storms, nasty bugs, earthquakes, whatever of a serious but much more limited duration nature. Dealing with that sort of thing, be it a bug that lays me out for weeks or an ice storm that knocks out the power for weeks... stuff like that which I have actually experienced in my lifetime... more than once ... is my focus. It is affordable, both financially and psychologically, to be able to cope with that sort of lesser yuck and so we have. But with strict self-imposed limits that keep it a whole lot less than preppers aim at, intentionally so.

From what I have observed too much preppers stuff is drowning in gun mania, paranoia, distopian fantasies and just plain unappealing silliness that does not strike me as mentally balanced or healthy. I do not want to go there. I do not want to live like that. and I do not promote anyone else going way out there, either. Balance in all things.

So I practice a certain amount of situational awareness and have enough to carry us through minor to some kinds of semi-major ick happening, because that sort of thing does happen now and then and we've used it all one way or another now and then. It was darn nice to be able to deal, ya know? And I do think each of us has a certain personal responsibility to be able to take care of ourselves in difficult events for a reasonable amount of time. That's all. That's my personal limit. We keep that current and enjoy our lives. This stuff is not remotely the focus of our existence. That feels wrong to me and a pretty miserable way to live. eh.

Could I actually cope with some of the more serious stuff? Yeah, at least for awhile, mostly because my people had a ranch and farm country mindset. You have a garden. You can stuff. You've got stored stuff because going to the store isn't easy or convenient and may be impossible in winter. I grow medicinal and culinary herbs, always have, and use them as needed. The nasty bug box has been opened once... Mr Northstar wanted to do a bunch of spray painting and thought that stuff would be useful keeping paint off him and fumes out of his lungs. It was.

Frankly, I think knowing how to deal without electric etc is more important than having some humongous storage of food or whatever. That sort of extreme hoarding... too much for me, frankly.

Do I pay attention to the news on stuff like Ebola? Sure. Nasty bugs sweep the globe from time to time and pretending it cannot and will not happen is stupid... but so is panicking over it. My level is that dictated by my own experience and that of relatives who indeed did cope with the 1918 Influenza and things like smallpox, polio, dysentery and other health woes that used to be quite common. Be reasonably prepared to handle sudden serious illness in the house. That can happen anytime. Has for us. That level of prep is useful in ordinary life and that is my main focus.

Note I haven't laid out any lists of what folks should do or have. Not my business. Your decision what you would wish you had to deal with this or that you personally consider reasonable. I've thrown out some possibilities and some easy to do amerliorations. That is kinda my limit.

For example our espaliered fruit trees that border all around our garden provide us with fruit from early summer through late autumn. I do not need doomsday to enjoy heck out of fresh off the tree peaches, plums, apples, pears etc, or berries from June through September, strawberries, raspberries, blackberries etc. Or planting potatoes in autumn and harvesting them the next autumn... with some summer stealing of baby new potatoes . Tastes wonderful and helps the budget. That is the sort of thing I think is worth doing, not stocking up on 500 pounds of wheat grain in buckets in the basement. Or turning my house into a fortress. Ok, nuff said.

One, I expressed a sentiment about buying some land North of Houston with running water on the property. I prefer to build a house that is fairly secure and can run off the grid generating it's own power via wind, solar, and water power generation. Second, I want the ability to recycle my sewage into an wet organic fertilizer type water. Why do I want to do this? Well, this relates to my religious beliefs of being a good steward to the land. Third, I would like to build some type of victory or small garden with an attached green house that can produce veggies and fruit year round. I would not have to depend on some type of grocery store that has veggies and grains with built in poison....GMAO's can be very bad! That really depends on the seed type! Fifth, I would like to build a smoke house and storage area are for a year's supply of food. This belief falls in line from ex-wife's grandparents who survived WW2 because they had stored 1 year supply of food for generations. Hey the Mormons are required to keep a 1 year food supply in case of bad times. I like that concept. With that idea, I would like to learn how to hunt! I intend to buy about 60 to 100 acres of land that has running water through the property, some forest acreage, a fish pond, and some open acreage. Currently, the properties have been researching do not meet all my requirements. However, I can buy property that has running water through it and develop the property to my specifications. Fifth, I would like build a safe room/armory room. Living the country, a person has to be prepared for all types emergencies. Better to be armed and never need a firearm than need the weapon and die for a lack of pre-planning.

smr wrote:
One, I expressed a sentiment about buying some land North of Houston with running water on the property. I prefer to build a house that is fairly secure and can run off the grid generating it's own power via wind, solar, and water power generation. Second, I want the ability to recycle my sewage into an wet organic fertilizer type water. Why do I want to do this? Well, this relates to my religious beliefs of being a good steward to the land. Third, I would like to build some type of victory or small garden with an attached green house that can produce veggies and fruit year round. I would not have to depend on some type of grocery store that has veggies and grains with built in poison....GMAO's can be very bad! That really depends on the seed type! Fifth, I would like to build a smoke house and storage area are for a year's supply of food. This belief falls in line from ex-wife's grandparents who survived WW2 because they had stored 1 year supply of food for generations. Hey the Mormons are required to keep a 1 year food supply in case of bad times. I like that concept. With that idea, I would like to learn how to hunt! I intend to buy about 60 to 100 acres of land that has running water through the property, some forest acreage, a fish pond, and some open acreage. Currently, the properties have been researching do not meet all my requirements. However, I can buy property that has running water through it and develop the property to my specifications. Fifth, I would like build a safe room/armory room. Living the country, a person has to be prepared for all types emergencies. Better to be armed and never need a firearm than need the weapon and die for a lack of pre-planning.

Do note that human excrement does not make good fertilizer. Humans have the wrong diet. We don't eat grass and hay. Human feces are actually bad as a fertilizer, as it is a source of disease in plants. Same goes for canine excrement.

The only thing I will add about weapons is that having a weapon around without the training and especially the will to use it is probably worse than not having one around at all.

And of course, simply telling yourself that you have the will to use it isn't any indication that you actually will if the crunch ever happens. This requires lots of training and conditioning.

Far better to focus on the immediate and practical needs (a garden, knowledge of hand tools etc.) which have immediate utility and payoff, as well as providing some "depth" if things like extreme weather events, prolonged power outages etc. happen. My personal feeling is the Apocalypse, if it actually does happen, will pretty much randomize the picture (the asteroid falls on the wilderness where all the survivalists live, for example ), so a general level of knowledge and preparation will do far more for most people than having a well stocked fortress in the back 40.

One, I know how to use firearms. My family does not know how to use firearms. I served in the military for 8 years. I can teach them but it's probably better for them to learn at a Gun range from a certified instuctor. Now, the concept is about being self sufficient and more self-reliant. Consider civilization dies when the power goes out within America. I have had enough of city/suburb living. I want to know the neighbors. The idea is build a house that operate off the grid and start adding onto the concept over the years.

I like to take the time to express my appreciation for some of this forum posters ideas and links. Thank you! I really appreciate some of the ideas and suggestions.

Thucydides wrote:The only thing I will add about weapons is that having a weapon around without the training and especially the will to use it is probably worse than not having one around at all.

And of course, simply telling yourself that you have the will to use it isn't any indication that you actually will if the crunch ever happens. This requires lots of training and conditioning.

Far better to focus on the immediate and practical needs (a garden, knowledge of hand tools etc.) which have immediate utility and payoff, as well as providing some "depth" if things like extreme weather events, prolonged power outages etc. happen. My personal feeling is the Apocalypse, if it actually does happen, will pretty much randomize the picture (the asteroid falls on the wilderness where all the survivalists live, for example ), so a general level of knowledge and preparation will do far more for most people than having a well stocked fortress in the back 40.

Hi Thucydides,

Agree with all this. And a fortress in the back forty just is not possible for most. If you can do it in a balanced way and want to, hey, go for it, anyone who can... but more toward the hippie hobby farm look than the fortress look. Maybe a hobby farm/ranch that you just happen to be able to defend. But if one wants to do that sort of stuff beyond my abilities or wants at least don't be obvious about it. That would be a blinking neon sign to target you for goodies, eh? Yep. And gives warning you are armed to the teeth so they should come prepared for that. You want to be boring and unremarkable. Better you should look like a pushover hobby ranch and they get a nasty surprise. Brr hope it never comes to this.

Thing is, most folks read about stuff that is way way beyond what they can do or want to do even if they can and they say, yuck, and don't do anything to make themselves able to take care of themselves a bit more or be a bit more prepared to deal with assorted crap that life throws at us now and then. That is not good for any of us because that totally unprepared person is the one gonna be a danger to everyone else if crap happens and the stores are empty for even a little while.

You see them on the tv every time there is a hurricane coming or somesuch. They're the ones rushing out to the store to stock up in the chaos crowd of other putoffsky not prepared panic-buying folks. Nuts. Be a good boy/girl scout and be prepared so you do not have to be one of those folks fighting over a bag of ice or whatever. Ok?

It may save your life or at least your nerves.

Hurts nothing to have some stuff in your car, including comfortable walking shoes/ hiking books, some food, some water, a HeatSheet and med kit, including an Ace bandage. I have one of those in my purse. why? I sprained my ankle in a grocery store once, being a klutz. Limping out was damn painful. Ever since, I've carried an Ace bandage. Notice Northstar tends to learn through unfortunate incidents that teach her to get her act together a bit more on this or that subject.

Hurts nothing to do it. Stuff in your pocket you'd be glad you had, in your purse or computer bag or whatever. Your important papers in a bugout bag you can grab and go in a fire/hurricane/tornado earthquake gotta get out this minute emergency ... this is mostly wildfire or storm, both of which happen. If your area is prone to such stuff be prepared. Insurance papers, all that. Hope you never need it., but ... no harm no foul and if you do then it is too late to run around trying to find you military discharge papers etc. Add some sets of socks and clean undies, a change of clothes, comfy shoes, some food and water that keeps etc. Think about it, what is useful and practical and not too heavy.

I guess I'm for preparedness stuff -and mindset- in a hurts nothing sort of level. Doing stuff you can afford, as you can afford it. Some of it is a one shot thing. Like our nasty bug box, which I hope never gets used except by Mr Northstar having another painting spree, but it was a box of peace of mind. One box, not a fully equipped level4 containment.

I do not have any problem with folks wanting to go beyond that if they've got the bucks to do it. Free country and all that. That is what helps their happy and peace. Fine. Go for it. And survival stuff can be a challenging skill set to learn, too. Fine. Just keep your balance and keep it affordable for you and yours, both financially and psychologically. And enjoy life. Don't be so busy setting up survival for hell that you never get to enjoy living. Works best that way.

cthia wrote:

smr wrote:
One, I expressed a sentiment about buying some land North of Houston with running water on the property. I prefer to build a house that is fairly secure and can run off the grid generating it's own power via wind, solar, and water power generation. Second, I want the ability to recycle my sewage into an wet organic fertilizer type water. Why do I want to do this? Well, this relates to my religious beliefs of being a good steward to the land. Third, I would like to build some type of victory or small garden with an attached green house that can produce veggies and fruit year round. I would not have to depend on some type of grocery store that has veggies and grains with built in poison....GMAO's can be very bad! That really depends on the seed type! Fifth, I would like to build a smoke house and storage area are for a year's supply of food. This belief falls in line from ex-wife's grandparents who survived WW2 because they had stored 1 year supply of food for generations. Hey the Mormons are required to keep a 1 year food supply in case of bad times. I like that concept. With that idea, I would like to learn how to hunt! I intend to buy about 60 to 100 acres of land that has running water through the property, some forest acreage, a fish pond, and some open acreage. Currently, the properties have been researching do not meet all my requirements. However, I can buy property that has running water through it and develop the property to my specifications. Fifth, I would like build a safe room/armory room. Living the country, a person has to be prepared for all types emergencies. Better to be armed and never need a firearm than need the weapon and die for a lack of pre-planning.

Do note that human excrement does not make good fertilizer. Humans have the wrong diet. We don't eat grass and hay. Human feces are actually bad as a fertilizer, as it is a source of disease in plants. Same goes for canine excrement.

Um, cythia,

There is disagreement with you on this... provided it is composted properly and for long enough.

See Farmers of Forty Centuries: Organic Farming in China, Korea and Japan by F. H. King and also The Humanure Handbook, by Joseph C. Jenkins and his website http://www.humanurehandbook.com or can be read online free at http://www.permaculturenews.org/ , plus links at those and just google humanure. The proper composting is absolutely necessary, imo.

Do we do this? No, we have a functioning septic system etc, but handling stuff this way sure beats the usual latrine horror. And there certainly are people who set up biosystems to recycle human waste safely. Should one research thoroughly? Absolutely. One that comes to mind involves a purpose dedicated pond/marsh and plants like water hyacinth and other marsh plants.

Gardening note. To start the potatoes gardening in Autumn you first buy certified disease free potato stock in Spring from a reputable source. DO NOT start with grocery store potatoes, even organic ones. I personally got mine from http://www.fedcoseeds.com, a non=profit co-op in Maine that has an excellent selection of seeds, potatoes, and lots more at reasonable prices. There are many other excellent garden seed etc sources. Pinetree Seeds. http://www.superseeds.com is another fave. Then there is http://www.rareseeds.com which is Baker Creek Heirloom Seeds . There are many more I could name.

You plant those in spring as per any good gardening book directions. When they are ready to harvest - the tops die off - you harvest them and set some 2 inch or so size ones aside to use for your next crop. Do NOT cut them in pieces. Do not cut your starter ones up either. Plant them whole. You plant the autumn planted ones same as you did the starter ones last spring. We put a layer of leaf mulch over them, also. Rotate your beds. We have had autumn planted potatoes survive -20 F and generally brutal winters and come up happily the next spring. They are tougher than one would think.

Home grown potatoes are wonderful.

Kinds we grow; Yukon Gold, Frontier Russet, Bintje, Magic Molly, Nicola, Elba, Red Pontiac, Chieftain, Russet Burbank, Carola. There are lots more wonderful ones out there. The Fedco site/catalog will have you drooling with potato lust.

I store my crop in brown cardboard boxes in a cool dark room. Check regularly for any going off. I've had no problems with them for months. Til all gone. Some years I've saved some in the house as insurance and planted them out in May. Worked fine but mainly we autumn plant. The house ones got pretty sprouty by planting time. You just plant them gently. They'll grow for you also.

Tomatoes and potatoes are the two highest yielding home grown crops. Learn to save tomato seeds. PM me if you want directions. It is easy but more than just drying them. Note, growing your own potatoes this way you always have potatoes in the ground, which is a bit of insurance in itself, eh?

Next highest yields, squashes -including pumpkins- and pole beans. We love Rouge Vif D'Etamples, aka Cinderella, pumpkins. Taste great. Roast and freeze or keep in cool dry place whole for a couple months. Pole Beans: Rattlesnake, Fortrex, Goldmarie. Blue Lake.

There are many other things that yield a lot .Mammoth Melting snow peas. National Pickling cukes. etc. Barbara winter squash from Thompson & Morgan is a delish and high yielding butternut. It is a big plant, running all over and producing a couple dozen big winter butternuts.

Get the book High Yield Gardening, by Marjorie Hunt and Brenda Bortz. It is out of print but available cheap used through amazon. It is worth its weight in gold for veggie gardening and also things like espaliering fruit trees and berry canes etc. If I could only have one gardening book this would be it.

cthia wrote:

smr wrote:
One, I expressed a sentiment about buying some land North of Houston with running water on the property. I prefer to build a house that is fairly secure and can run off the grid generating it's own power via wind, solar, and water power generation. Second, I want the ability to recycle my sewage into an wet organic fertilizer type water. Why do I want to do this? Well, this relates to my religious beliefs of being a good steward to the land. Third, I would like to build some type of victory or small garden with an attached green house that can produce veggies and fruit year round. I would not have to depend on some type of grocery store that has veggies and grains with built in poison....GMAO's can be very bad! That really depends on the seed type! Fifth, I would like to build a smoke house and storage area are for a year's supply of food. This belief falls in line from ex-wife's grandparents who survived WW2 because they had stored 1 year supply of food for generations. Hey the Mormons are required to keep a 1 year food supply in case of bad times. I like that concept. With that idea, I would like to learn how to hunt! I intend to buy about 60 to 100 acres of land that has running water through the property, some forest acreage, a fish pond, and some open acreage. Currently, the properties have been researching do not meet all my requirements. However, I can buy property that has running water through it and develop the property to my specifications. Fifth, I would like build a safe room/armory room. Living the country, a person has to be prepared for all types emergencies. Better to be armed and never need a firearm than need the weapon and die for a lack of pre-planning.

Do note that human excrement does not make good fertilizer. Humans have the wrong diet. We don't eat grass and hay. Human feces are actually bad as a fertilizer, as it is a source of disease in plants. Same goes for canine excrement.

Northstar wrote:
Um, cythia,

There is disagreement with you on this... provided it is composted properly and for long enough.

See Farmers of Forty Centuries: Organic Farming in China, Korea and Japan by F. H. King and also The Humanure Handbook, by Joseph C. Jenkins and his website http://www.humanurehandbook.com or can be read online free at http://www.permaculturenews.org/ , plus links at those and just google humanure. The proper composting is absolutely necessary, imo.

Do we do this? No, we have a functioning septic system etc, but handling stuff this way sure beats the usual latrine horror. And there certainly are people who set up biosystems to recycle human waste safely. Should one research thoroughly? Absolutely. One that comes to mind involves a purpose dedicated pond/marsh and plants like water hyacinth and other marsh plants.

Thanks for the links Northstar. I've heard of it but have not read it. My tribe and others shy away from human manure. Sure, it can be used, Native Americans even used it when necessary. Other measures must be employed when one does - Peat moss (etc etc) for instance. But the yield is not comparable to grain and grass source manure, and drought sensitivity and disease resistance is low, with human sourced feces manure (in our experience). Also, there are certain food sources that we will absolutely not attempt to fertilize with human manure.

I am certain there is much my tribe and others can learn as well, but what we do know is tried and true and change won't occur overnight. I also wonder about climate differences of Japan and here. I personally am not the one to ask about this within my tribe. The elders are. I'll certainly bring the discussion up at the upcomimg pauau (powow). It promises to be interesting. I also recall the elders stating that human manure strips soil nutrients pretty quickly. I may be wrong. It's just not my area.

Other measures that "we" take is adding this source manure in the winter, on free land (skipping a full growing season) and "we" ensure extra vigorous mixture within the soil.

However, I do recognize, in extreme conditions as those under discussion, human manure may be the only manure source at hand!

Also, I do recall certain Native tribes that did use non hay-grain manure sources, but their diet was quite different - because of the fertilizer source and other factors. One also must consider the overall health and conditions of the soil in the particular region and the activities native to that soil. For example, is it basically a grazing region? Are their animals used for travel? Goats, oxen, horses, donkey, mule. Soil health and condition in these regions would be different.

This outbreak is starting to get out of control.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2014/08/23/ebola-spreads-in-nigeria-liberia-has-1000-cases/14489251/

The US media is beginning to report on this subject.