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Hmm, Blacks were the first Americans?

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Hmm, Blacks were the first Americans?
Post by pokermind   » Tue Aug 19, 2014 7:59 am

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Evidence showing Blacks from Australia may have been the first Americans

Image

Pic of a Terra De Fuego native with negroloid features painted during Darwin's expedition.

See http://atlantablackstar.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/Fuegan-Picture.jpg for more.

Thought provoking, but now our Ausies will be more insufferably smug ;)

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Re: Hmm, Blacks were the first Americans?
Post by Tenshinai   » Tue Aug 19, 2014 2:04 pm

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Evidence showing Blacks from Australia may have been the first Americans


Uh, one problem Poky, "blacks" and aboriginies are not closely related.
In fact, caucasians are more closely related to aboriginies than africans are.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup
Y-DNA
]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/ca/World_Map_of_Y-DNA_Haplogroups.png/1280px-World_Map_of_Y-DNA_Haplogroups.png

Mt-DNA (mind the projection style)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... ations.jpg

Thought provoking, but now our Ausies will be more insufferably smug


Well, evidence in general says direct migration is unlikely, but i wouldn´t be the slightest surprised if there was at least some.

Stranger things have definitely happened.
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Re: Hmm, Blacks were the first Americans?
Post by Thucydides   » Tue Aug 19, 2014 10:11 pm

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Actually, some skeletal remains like the Kennewick Man predate the commonly accepted arrival of humans across the Bearing Straight and seem to have been Caucasian. Where they came from and how they got here ahead of the Asians form Siberia is an interesting question to think about.
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Re: Hmm, Blacks were the first Americans?
Post by Hutch   » Wed Aug 20, 2014 8:25 am

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Thucydides wrote:Actually, some skeletal remains like the Kennewick Man predate the commonly accepted arrival of humans across the Bearing Straight and seem to have been Caucasian. Where they came from and how they got here ahead of the Asians form Siberia is an interesting question to think about.



Indeed. To quote from the redoubtable Mellisa Malley (from Eric Flint's Ring of Fire series):
The schoolteacher planted her arms akimbo and gave Nichols and Adams the same glare which had cowed thousands of students over the years. "What?" she demanded. "Did you think you were actually smarterthan these people?"


"Primitive" people (circa last 10-15,000 years) had brains as large and presumably as capable as ours. That some few went exploring and through sheer luck (bad or good) ended up in new places is becoming more accepted these days.

IMHO.
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Re: Hmm, Blacks were the first Americans?
Post by Arol   » Wed Aug 20, 2014 1:52 pm

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Thucydides wrote:Actually, some skeletal remains like the Kennewick Man predate the commonly accepted arrival of humans across the Bearing Straight and seem to have been Caucasian. Where they came from and how they got here ahead of the Asians form Siberia is an interesting question to think about.

Re. The Kenwick Man, wasn't there some controversy over his remains?
AmInd interest groups were trying to prevent testing on the remains?
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Re: Hmm, Blacks were the first Americans?
Post by Thucydides   » Thu Aug 21, 2014 1:02 am

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Arol wrote:
Thucydides wrote:Actually, some skeletal remains like the Kennewick Man predate the commonly accepted arrival of humans across the Bearing Straight and seem to have been Caucasian. Where they came from and how they got here ahead of the Asians form Siberia is an interesting question to think about.

Re. The Kenwick Man, wasn't there some controversy over his remains?
AmInd interest groups were trying to prevent testing on the remains?


There are lots of controversies, and from what I remember, some tribe was trying to claim Kennewick Man was a member of their tribe and insisted the remains be turned over for burial.

I won't get into the whys and wherefores, but one issue seems to be that the idea that there were humans in North America before the arrival of the current Native Americans disturbs multiple narratives and creation myths. From a rational perspective, I'd much rather understand where Kennewick Man came from and how he got here, since that is one more piece in the puzzle of human ancestry and migration (think of how we only recently understood the Ancestors inter mated with Neanderthal and Denisovan peoples during their migrations, leaving a small amount of Neanderthal or Denisovan DNA in many of us today).
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Re: Hmm, Blacks were the first Americans?
Post by Arol   » Thu Aug 21, 2014 6:35 am

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Thucydides wrote:...I'd much rather understand where Kennewick Man came from and how he got here,...

My thoughts exactly!
Just think of what he had experienced to end up where he did!
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Re: Hmm, Blacks were the first Americans?
Post by Tenshinai   » Thu Aug 21, 2014 9:22 am

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Thucydides wrote:Actually, some skeletal remains like the Kennewick Man predate the commonly accepted arrival of humans across the Bearing Straight and seem to have been Caucasian. Where they came from and how they got here ahead of the Asians form Siberia is an interesting question to think about.


Eh, they do not predate known migration to America. Kennewick man is dated around 9500 years ago, the Clovis culture that is theorised as a primary origin is dated around 13000 years ago.

The Bering bridge closed up for walkable crossing 17000 years ago. (or something like that, i wish everyone could use a single dating standard when referring to things...)

And no, Kennewick man is NOT "Caucasian", the closest modern relatives has been found to be the Ainu of northern Japan, and to a lesser degree some Polynesian groups.

Suggestion:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category: ... e_Americas

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Models_of ... _New_World
Cambridge DNA Services estimates humans entered the Americas around 25,000 years ago. Other geneticists have variously estimated that peoples of Asia and the Americas were part of the same population from about 42,000 to 21,000 years ago.
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