Why are Roger and Nimashet together?

As we not so patiently wait for the next book in the series to come out, something to ponder.

Nimashet starts off as a Marine Sergeant, nearing the end of her enlistment, as we find out later. She has been in the Bronze Battalion a while, and Roger does not even know her name until they are marooned on Marduk. She knows that he is spoiled and bratty, but with gorgeous hair, and that she, as a bodyguard, is beneath his notice.

Roger finds Nimashet physically attractive, yet he has been fending off good-looking gold-diggers for years now. Certainly times of great stress can produce a linkage between people, but why would he not be attracted to Corporal Hooker, or the Sgt Major, or Dr. O'Casey?

What happens so that they wind up dancing together in Ran Tai in Book Two?

Thoughts?

Before that fateful trip, Roger had never had very much contact with his guards; had never thought of them as anything except 'part of the furniture' that was to be mostly ignored. He had more contact with the officers and senior NCOs, but otherwise didn't pay any attention to the rest.

Once 'the trek' began across Marduk, he began learning about them and caring about them. Once he got to know Nimashet (and she got to know the 'real' Roger), I think that a natural attraction took over.

As far as Roger's avoidance of 'gold diggers' is concerned, he resists that attraction for a while - but eventually realizes that a) Nimashet is the absolute opposite of all those he avoided over the years; and b) she is his soul-mate and the one that he wants by his side. He might like and respect some of the other females in the Company, but Nimashet is the right one for him.

Why do two people mesh so perfectly?? That is an answer that I don't have!

Hank Plantagenet wrote:As we not so patiently wait for the next book in the series to come out, something to ponder.

Nimashet starts off as a Marine Sergeant, nearing the end of her enlistment, as we find out later. She has been in the Bronze Battalion a while, and Roger does not even know her name until they are marooned on Marduk. She knows that he is spoiled and bratty, but with gorgeous hair, and that she, as a bodyguard, is beneath his notice.

Roger finds Nimashet physically attractive, yet he has been fending off good-looking gold-diggers for years now. Certainly times of great stress can produce a linkage between people, but why would he not be attracted to Corporal Hooker, or the Sgt Major, or Dr. O'Casey?

What happens so that they wind up dancing together in Ran Tai in Book Two?

Thoughts?

Renegade13 wrote:Before that fateful trip, Roger had never had very much contact with his guards; had never thought of them as anything except 'part of the furniture' that was to be mostly ignored. He had more contact with the officers and senior NCOs, but otherwise didn't pay any attention to the rest.

Once 'the trek' began across Marduk, he began learning about them and caring about them. Once he got to know Nimashet (and she got to know the 'real' Roger), I think that a natural attraction took over.

As far as Roger's avoidance of 'gold diggers' is concerned, he resists that attraction for a while - but eventually realizes that a) Nimashet is the absolute opposite of all those he avoided over the years; and b) she is his soul-mate and the one that he wants by his side. He might like and respect some of the other females in the Company, but Nimashet is the right one for him.

Why do two people mesh so perfectly?? That is an answer that I don't have!

I didn't mean to imply that Nimashet was or is a gold digger. Certainly, someone who resisted marriage to the prince, or the emperor, for so long is not interested in money and power for their own sake. I realize that the development of the relationship comes with the development of Roger as a functioning human being, instead of a caricature of a foppish prince, yet I am just curious as to how it happened. Was Nimashet always riding next to Roger on the trail after Marshad? Was she assigned to back him up as he was out hunting for the pot?

There is not much textev that I can recall, unless I am forgetting something.

Nimashet is depicted with a crush on Roger from quite early in the first book (still on the ship, IIRC). And Roger's initial attraction to her is also physical; she's described as essentially the most conventionally beautiful person available.

They both fiercely suppress their feelings until the beginning of the second book, then are forced by circumstances (and eventually direct orders on Pahner's and later Kosutic's part - I love those bits) to acknowledge and accept them.

I do feel Roger overreacts a little at the turning point; he doesn't just want a temporary relationship (which would make sense for both of them) - he wants to get married. This might have something to do with the fact that he's very young (significantly younger than Nimashet, I suspect) and has never been subject to these feelings before. He's also rebounding off Kosta's death. Of course he's going to want to go all the way - he's just come face to face with mortality and doesn't want to wait for someone who might be more "appropriate."

Other elements are that he's rebellious and might subconsciously want a consort who would shock the court nobles he scorns. He's also used to having his way, although that part of it is played more subtly.

I rather expect some of this will be addressed in the next book, particularly given the snippets we've had thus far. By Capital standards, he IS overreacting in the ennoblements he's passing out.

JenBurdoo2 wrote:Nimashet is depicted with a crush on Roger from quite early in the first book (still on the ship, IIRC). And Roger's initial attraction to her is also physical; she's described as essentially the most conventionally beautiful person available.

They both fiercely suppress their feelings until the beginning of the second book, then are forced by circumstances (and eventually direct orders on Pahner's and later Kosutic's part - I love those bits) to acknowledge and accept them.

I do feel Roger overreacts a little at the turning point; he doesn't just want a temporary relationship (which would make sense for both of them) - he wants to get married. This might have something to do with the fact that he's very young (significantly younger than Nimashet, I suspect) and has never been subject to these feelings before. He's also rebounding off Kosta's death. Of course he's going to want to go all the way - he's just come face to face with mortality and doesn't want to wait for someone who might be more "appropriate."

Other elements are that he's rebellious and might subconsciously want a consort who would shock the court nobles he scorns. He's also used to having his way, although that part of it is played more subtly.

I rather expect some of this will be addressed in the next book, particularly given the snippets we've had thus far. By Capital standards, he IS overreacting in the ennoblements he's passing out.

I guess we may never know what exactly was the genesis of the attraction they have, but once the relationship does get going, it certainly is one heck of a roller-coaster ride.

You are right in that is gets better once Pahner gets involved and sends Nimashet out to Roger on the riverside of despair. The whole scene with Nimashet, the Sergeant Major, and Eleanora is classic.


"Nimashet, I'm going to be blunt," the chief of staff said after a moment. "You have to marry Roger."

"No." The sergeant stood back up quickly, eyes flashing. "If this is what you wanted to talk about, you can—"

"Sit down, Sergeant," Kosutic said sharply.

"You'd better not use my rank when talking about something like this, Sergeant Major!" Despreaux snapped back angrily.

"I will when it affects the security of the Empire," Kosutic replied icily. "Sit. Down. Now."


I do agree that Roger certainly overreacted to Nimashet. I think it stems from his naivete in social relationships that comes from his isolation in the court and no one ever trying to get close to him for other than political advantage, save for Kostas.

I would say, though, that the ennoblements so far depicted in the snippets are not an overreaction. He now has a majority in the house that confirms his appointments, as we saw from the quick acceptance of Julian as IBI director. Also, with the requirement of two-thirds majorities in both houses to get impeached as emperor, it becomes increasingly unlikely that it will ever happen once he stacked the upper house with his friends and supporters. I think he is trying to eliminate the old "Capital standards."

Hank Plantagenet wrote:As we not so patiently wait for the next book in the series to come out, something to ponder.

Nimashet starts off as a Marine Sergeant, nearing the end of her enlistment, as we find out later. She has been in the Bronze Battalion a while, and Roger does not even know her name until they are marooned on Marduk. She knows that he is spoiled and bratty, but with gorgeous hair, and that she, as a bodyguard, is beneath his notice.

Roger finds Nimashet physically attractive, yet he has been fending off good-looking gold-diggers for years now. Certainly times of great stress can produce a linkage between people, but why would he not be attracted to Corporal Hooker, or the Sgt Major, or Dr. O'Casey?

What happens so that they wind up dancing together in Ran Tai in Book Two?

Thoughts?

Go back an re read book 1, Roger and Nimashet flirted with each other through the entire book including Nimashet braiding Rogers hair, Nimashet learning why Roger doesn't just jump her bones from Kostas, to Roger being made her Platoon leader before the fight with the Kranolta to fawning over his wounded body after the fight with the Kranolta. Of course who is the first person that Roger asks about after waking up among the wounded? Nimashet. From that point on Roger was her platoon leader and they couldn't be that far apart. Also after the fight with the Kranolta is when the Sergeant Major confronts Nimashet about her pursuing Roger since the ship:

She touched the prince's face and picked up the diagnostic tag attached to his uniform. There were only a few of those, and she was surprised Dobrescu had used it on him. Or maybe she wasn't. There were more seriously wounded—the tag told her that immediately with its readout of his alpha rhythms, blood pressure, pulse, and oxygen—but there were none so precious.
She touched his face again, gently.

"He gets to you, doesn't he?" a gravelly voice asked.

She froze and looked up at the sergeant major.

"You look like a rabbit in a spotlight," Kosutic told her with a quiet chuckle. The senior NCO had propped herself up on her uninjured right arm to contemplate the squad leader with a quizzical smile.

"I was just checking on Third Platoon's wounded, Sergeant Major," Despreaux said guiltily . . . and almost truthfully. That had been her rationale for the visit, but she'd realized almost immediately what she was really after.

"Try to tell the Old Man that, girl—not me!" the sergeant major snapped, shifting her burnt and mangled left arm into a better position. Or, at least, one that was marginally less uncomfortable. "You haven't so much as looked at any of the other wounded. You've just been making cow eyes at Roger."

"Sergeant Major—" Despreaux began.

"Can it, I said! I know exactly what's going on. It was obvious even back on the ship, if you had eyes. And I do."

"But . . . I hated him back on the ship," the sergeant protested. "He was so . . . so. . . ."

"Snotty?" Kosutic suggested with a chuckle that cut off abruptly. "Shit, don't make me laugh, girl! Yeah. And you were making cow eyes at him, snotty attitude and all."

"I was not making cow eyes," Despreaux insisted firmly.

"Call it what you want, girl," the older woman said with a grin. "I call it cow eyes."

Despreaux looked around almost desperately, but all the other wounded seemed to be asleep. If they weren't, they were being incredibly disciplined in not laughing at her. Then she looked back at Kosutic.

"What are you going to do about it?"

"Nothing," the sergeant major said, and chuckled again at her look of surprise. "We've got bigger things to worry about, Sergeant. And so far he seems to be either oblivious or beating you off with a club. I'm not sure which."

Now remember what happened just after that dance floor? Roger tried to explain, drunkenly, what Kostas told Nimashet way back in the book why he is not pursuing her: Because of how viscous the court is.

So how we got to the Dance Floor was easy it was all through Book 1 they were flirting with each other all the way from space, through the jungle and through a major battle.

Neither Roger OR Nimashet planned on them happening - in fact, Nimashet asked Kostas if Roger was homosexual (March Upcountry). Nimashet herself had not had a "fling" in her whole time in the Bronze Batallion - however, she was not a virgin. Roger himself was not a virgin, either; however, he HAD had (according to several statements from Kostas, and - later - from Roger himself) suffered several rather disastrous encounters with women pre-Marduk. What those same disastrous encounters left in Roger was a VERY sour taste for the typical "best of breed" encounters with those of his "station" that would have been "de rigeur" (and in fact was) pre-Marduk. Nimashet herself doubtless lacked for suitors among the Marines; however, for SOME reason, nobody in Bronze caught her interest until Roget the Barbarian came along. (Even Eva couldn't explain it; however, SHE noticed Nimashet's interest in Roger before anyone else - including Julian, let alone Roger himself.)
The deciding factor was onboard the captured Saint ship ("We Few") - but NOT the conversation between Eleanor, Eva, and Nimashet; it was the convo immediately after between ROGER and Nimashet. The first conversation was Eva - and Eleanor for that matter - whacking Nimashet with the clue-by-four regarding Roger (Roger as Emperor and Roger as Roger). Eva pointed out that were Roger merely Heir Secundus OR still Heir Tertius, she would have pounced on him in an Imperial minute. (Nimashet admited that much - in fact, she had even told ROGER that much on Marduk before Col. Pahner made that real-estate deal ("March to the Stars"); she simply had not told any of the Marines about that convo with Roger - none of their business.) Roger could care less about dynastic marriages - or any of that sort of nonsense; that has to do with his pre-Nimashet dating experiences - and I don't blame him one bit. Roger and Nimashet are their generation's Tomcat and Alexandra (as in Roger's mother) - with the roles reversed. (Not kidding; in fact, I am thinking of a conversation between Roger and Tomcat in "We Few" in which he whacked TOMCAT with the clue-by-four; Catrone tried to deny it; however, Roger was having none of it - sound familiar? In fact, consider the later conversation between Roger's mother and Catrone before she started the abdication process - and Catrone knew for certain that Roger did NOT tell her about the Roger/Catrone conversation earlier; he was unable to. Yet even Catrone could not argue with the implacability of Roger's logic - and not merely because he was Heir Primus, either. Catrone and Alexandra are going to happen for the same reason that Roger and Nimashet happened; it makes way too much sense - logically and almost any other way - for BOTH relationships to happen. (It doesn't matter that Roger's mother is no longer Empress - or that Roger is now Emperor; both relationship need to happen for the good of asll concerned; that they make sense for the good of the Empire of Man is icing on the proverbial cake.)

PGHammer wrote:Neither Roger OR Nimashet planned on them happening - in fact, Nimashet asked Kostas if Roger was homosexual (March Upcountry). Nimashet herself had not had a "fling" in her whole time in the Bronze Batallion - however, she was not a virgin. Roger himself was not a virgin, either; however, he HAD had (according to several statements from Kostas, and - later - from Roger himself) suffered several rather disastrous encounters with women pre-Marduk. What those same disastrous encounters left in Roger was a VERY sour taste for the typical "best of breed" encounters with those of his "station" that would have been "de rigeur" (and in fact was) pre-Marduk. Nimashet herself doubtless lacked for suitors among the Marines; however, for SOME reason, nobody in Bronze caught her interest until Roget the Barbarian came along. (Even Eva couldn't explain it; however, SHE noticed Nimashet's interest in Roger before anyone else - including Julian, let alone Roger himself.)
The deciding factor was onboard the captured Saint ship ("We Few") - but NOT the conversation between Eleanor, Eva, and Nimashet; it was the convo immediately after between ROGER and Nimashet. The first conversation was Eva - and Eleanor for that matter - whacking Nimashet with the clue-by-four regarding Roger (Roger as Emperor and Roger as Roger). Eva pointed out that were Roger merely Heir Secundus OR still Heir Tertius, she would have pounced on him in an Imperial minute. (Nimashet admited that much - in fact, she had even told ROGER that much on Marduk before Col. Pahner made that real-estate deal ("March to the Stars"); she simply had not told any of the Marines about that convo with Roger - none of their business.) Roger could care less about dynastic marriages - or any of that sort of nonsense; that has to do with his pre-Nimashet dating experiences - and I don't blame him one bit. Roger and Nimashet are their generation's Tomcat and Alexandra (as in Roger's mother) - with the roles reversed. (Not kidding; in fact, I am thinking of a conversation between Roger and Tomcat in "We Few" in which he whacked TOMCAT with the clue-by-four; Catrone tried to deny it; however, Roger was having none of it - sound familiar? In fact, consider the later conversation between Roger's mother and Catrone before she started the abdication process - and Catrone knew for certain that Roger did NOT tell her about the Roger/Catrone conversation earlier; he was unable to. Yet even Catrone could not argue with the implacability of Roger's logic - and not merely because he was Heir Primus, either. Catrone and Alexandra are going to happen for the same reason that Roger and Nimashet happened; it makes way too much sense - logically and almost any other way - for BOTH relationships to happen. (It doesn't matter that Roger's mother is no longer Empress - or that Roger is now Emperor; both relationship need to happen for the good of asll concerned; that they make sense for the good of the Empire of Man is icing on the proverbial cake.)

I think Tomcat's wife might be a tad upset if he kicked her out in order to marry Alexandra.

The enhancements from the biosculpt disguise certainly didnt discourage the romance.