Military Speculations

n7axw wrote:Merlin seemed to be assuming that if OBS is going to react, it will be at a specific place to supress the violation of the proscriptions to which it is reacting. So he introduces steam by conducting his test on an island so remote that if OBS reacts, no one will know the difference.

Merlin seems to have bet that the OBS won't wake up to anything short of Commercial levels of Electricity. But there's no guarantee that the OBS wouldn't then go after any violation of the proscriptions to reinforce its "innovation bad" message.

n7axw wrote:My own wager here is that OBS is not automated and requires direction, probably from the computer in the basement of the Temple. Or, there is a suspicion that Langhorne's flagship is out there somewhere. Maybe it contains control station for OBS(shrug). It will be interesting to see how it all turns out.

Don

You're probably right. Merlin can't plan on "probably right," he has to plan on as close to a worst case basis as he can without crippling all innovation.

why not exhume the bodies of adam and eves to get their implants, would they still be allowed access in the church systems?

Hi Weird Harold,

Because the textev says each cell can devastate a continent, and Safehold doesn't have six continents it can spare, nor would aiming them all into the sea be all that good for Safehold either.

Each cell is huge, and could effectively wreck Safehold all by itself.

Plus, RFC has informed us that the Rakurai can reload itself.

To repeat that, OWL has discovered it can make new KEW's all by itself without being ordered to do so by anyone on the ground, ie it's industrial module is very big.

One wonders if it will be what 'wakes up' in 20 years, even though its been alert all these years; ie when it turns on the temple video screen for a report, it will appear to the temple priests to pass the Turing test, and be taken for an archangel.

Interesting times, eh?

L

Weird Harold wrote:

SWM wrote:In addition, the OBS only has six cells loaded.

Where is that interesting bit of Textev and why doesn't Merlin just trigger six rakuri strikes on deserted sections of Armageddon Reef?

The OBS isn't programmed to destroy the world, it is programmed to interdict violations of the proscriptions wherever they might be seen (except for the Temple.) If the violations when it wakes up are world-wide, then the interdictions -- aka Rakuri -- are also world-wide.

I'm simply making worst case assumptions, because making best case assumptions and being wrong gets you dead.

Weird Harold wrote:

SWM wrote:In addition, the OBS only has six cells loaded.

Where is that interesting bit of Textev and why doesn't Merlin just trigger six rakuri strikes on deserted sections of Armageddon Reef?

The OBS isn't programmed to destroy the world, it is programmed to interdict violations of the proscriptions wherever they might be seen (except for the Temple.) If the violations when it wakes up are world-wide, then the interdictions -- aka Rakuri -- are also world-wide.

I'm simply making worst case assumptions, because making best case assumptions and being wrong gets you dead.

You really don't know that it is programed at all. Its only gone off once and that at Armaggedon Reef when Langhorne was running the show. Merlin seems to believe that the control for OBS is under the Temple, but is just guessing like we are. So who is really to know how to judge best case and worst case assumptions?

Don

n7axw wrote:You really don't know that it is programed at all. Its only gone off once and that at Armaggedon Reef when Langhorne was running the show. Merlin seems to believe that the control for OBS is under the Temple, but is just guessing like we are. So who is really to know how to judge best case and worst case assumptions?

Don

Merlin seems to think it CAN BE programmed for autonomous interdictions. If it CAN BE it is probably best to assume it HAS BEEN until you can prove differently.

It is fairly simple to judge "worst Case" vs "Best case" -- in "Worst Case" everyone dies; in "best case" only a few die.

Weird Harold wrote:

n7axw wrote:You really don't know that it is programed at all. Its only gone off once and that at Armaggedon Reef when Langhorne was running the show. Merlin seems to believe that the control for OBS is under the Temple, but is just guessing like we are. So who is really to know how to judge best case and worst case assumptions?

Don

Merlin seems to think it CAN BE programmed for autonomous interdictions. If it CAN BE it is probably best to assume it HAS BEEN until you can prove differently.

It is fairly simple to judge "worst Case" vs "Best case" -- in "Worst Case" everyone dies; in "best case" only a few die.

nah - we know that they had highly sophisticated AI systems available, probably much more powerful than OWL, so it's not as if they would have had to setup some improvised governing system using punched cards or bits of string!

But that nit aside, we have to go back to the fundamental purpose of Safehold - to preserve humanity, and that all sides - Langhorne or Shan Wei - agreed on. So village, city or even nation level smashes - yes, but complete wipeout of the last humans in the universe... I think not!

isaac_newton wrote:...we have to go back to the fundamental purpose of Safehold - to preserve humanity, and that all sides - Langhorne or Shan Wei - agreed on. So village, city or even nation level smashes - yes, but complete wipeout of the last humans in the universe... I think not!

What happens when the OBS encounters the paradox of "Must destroy prohibited technology" and "Must preserve humanity" when following its imperative to destroy prohibited tech would sterilize the planet?

Would the OBS even be programmed to preserve humanity separately from the command to destroy prohibited tech? Would Langhorne's programmer even think such a command was necessary?

If the OBS has been given no instructions beyond "destroy all prohibited tech if they start using electricity" would it know or care that Safehold was the last refuge of humanity?

Mind you, I personally don't think such a drastic action will ever happen, but that's because I believe Merlin is planning on the basis that it could happen if he screws up.

Weird Harold wrote:

isaac_newton wrote:...we have to go back to the fundamental purpose of Safehold - to preserve humanity, and that all sides - Langhorne or Shan Wei - agreed on. So village, city or even nation level smashes - yes, but complete wipeout of the last humans in the universe... I think not!

What happens when the OBS encounters the paradox of "Must destroy prohibited technology" and "Must preserve humanity" when following its imperative to destroy prohibited tech would sterilize the planet?

Would the OBS even be programmed to preserve humanity separately from the command to destroy prohibited tech? Would Langhorne's programmer even think such a command was necessary?

If the OBS has been given no instructions beyond "destroy all prohibited tech if they start using electricity" would it know or care that Safehold was the last refuge of humanity?

Mind you, I personally don't think such a drastic action will ever happen, but that's because I believe Merlin is planning on the basis that it could happen if he screws up.

Sometimes we have to take refuge in the story line...Would RFC write a story in which humanity is wiped out and then end the serries....Naaah!

Don