Post war plans

kzt wrote:

roseandheather wrote:*wails* He can't do that!! We'd miss the blossoming romances! We'd miss the weddings! We'd miss the treecat bondings!! We'd miss seeing the GA leadership scheming together!! Did I mention we'd miss the weddings??

Quite true, but you say that like it's a bad thing.

That is clear proof that your a guy. And straight, to boot. How very sad

Zakharra wrote:
The problem with that is the RF didn't think Manticore and Haven would ever join together. they absolutely did not see the GA forming and the GA's existence throws a huge wrench in their carefully laid plans. Especially since the RF's plans hinge mainly on the rest of the human explored galaxy -not- realizing what the RF is or what their plans are in the long run. It's a lot harder for the RF to pull the wool over the GA's eyes now that the GA is aware of some of the MAlign's deep laid plans. The RF intended to be the big winner in the League's break up. That plan is threatened by the GA's existence. For the RF/MAlign to succeed, the GA has to be destroyed.

I don't see the GA accepting the RF's leadership in anything. Certainly not in any political endeavor. I think the treecats are going to play a huge role in preventing the RF from penetrating the GA to any real degree.

Get this, folks. I first said it about 5 years ago, after reading the exposition of the RF in the books, then some Pearl where David was saying that not all their ideas were necessarily bad, but the methods the current MAlign leadership has embraced are pretty ugly.

I think the RF survives the coming war, and is a major post SL power, though not the dominant one. I DO NOT think the MAlign survives, however.

Albrecht is toast. Not sure but what one, or maybe two, of the boys survive.

We'll see. Should only take another 8-10 years.

dreamrider

dreamrider wrote:

Zakharra wrote:
The problem with that is the RF didn't think Manticore and Haven would ever join together. they absolutely did not see the GA forming and the GA's existence throws a huge wrench in their carefully laid plans. Especially since the RF's plans hinge mainly on the rest of the human explored galaxy -not- realizing what the RF is or what their plans are in the long run. It's a lot harder for the RF to pull the wool over the GA's eyes now that the GA is aware of some of the MAlign's deep laid plans. The RF intended to be the big winner in the League's break up. That plan is threatened by the GA's existence. For the RF/MAlign to succeed, the GA has to be destroyed.

I don't see the GA accepting the RF's leadership in anything. Certainly not in any political endeavor. I think the treecats are going to play a huge role in preventing the RF from penetrating the GA to any real degree.

Get this, folks. I first said it about 5 years ago, after reading the exposition of the RF in the books, then some Pearl where David was saying that not all their ideas were necessarily bad, but the methods the current MAlign leadership has embraced are pretty ugly.

I think the RF survives the coming war, and is a major post SL power, though not the dominant one. I DO NOT think the MAlign survives, however.

Albrecht is toast. Not sure but what one, or maybe two, of the boys survive.

We'll see. Should only take another 8-10 years.

dreamrider

If Albrecht is toast, can you serve him with eggs sunny-side up and hash browns?

In all seriousness, I agree. Manticore, Grayson, and Haven? The MAlign is fucked.

roseandheather wrote:

dreamrider wrote:
Get this, folks. I first said it about 5 years ago, after reading the exposition of the RF in the books, then some Pearl where David was saying that not all their ideas were necessarily bad, but the methods the current MAlign leadership has embraced are pretty ugly.

I think the RF survives the coming war, and is a major post SL power, though not the dominant one. I DO NOT think the MAlign survives, however.

Albrecht is toast. Not sure but what one, or maybe two, of the boys survive.

We'll see. Should only take another 8-10 years.

dreamrider

If Albrecht is toast, can you serve him with eggs sunny-side up and hash browns?

In all seriousness, I agree. Manticore, Grayson, and Haven? The MAlign is fucked.

Don't forget Beowulf, Erewhon or, especially, Torch. While Manticore and Haven, and to a lesser extent Grayson, are conventional powers, they are still limited in exactly who they can deal with, where they can go and what they can achieve by the conventional nature of their diplomatic, economic and military power or influence.

The way human space will be going to hell in a handbasket following the Solarian League's disintegration, I don't think that conventional power is going to be enough to deal with all the potential hotspots where the GA will be forced to counteract the MAlign's invidious activities.

In many instances, the circumstances will demand something other than conventional power, and that is where Beowulf, Erewhon and Torch will each be able to make an important contribution, because of how their societies' respective peculiarities make them unique among the community of star nations.

hanuman wrote:In many instances, the circumstances will demand something other than conventional power, and that is where Beowulf, Erewhon and Torch will each be able to make an important contribution, because of how their societies' respective peculiarities make them unique among the community of star nations.

A battalion is enough to cover a single town or maybe a small city. There are more planets, much less cities, in SL controlled space than Haven, Manticore, the AE and Beowulf have battalions. So you better not be trying the Mogadishu model, as it simply won't work.

hanuman wrote:Don't forget Beowulf, Erewhon or, especially, Torch.

Also don't forget the Andermani Empire -- Although that is precisely what the GA hoped the MAlign would do when the AE declined to join the GA. The AE was left out of the GA so that they could concentrate on finding and killing the MAlign while the GA dealt with the Solarian League.

Weird Harold wrote:

hanuman wrote:Don't forget Beowulf, Erewhon or, especially, Torch.

Also don't forget the Andermani Empire -- Although that is precisely what the GA hoped the MAlign would do when the AE declined to join the GA. The AE was left out of the GA so that they could concentrate on finding and killing the MAlign while the GA dealt with the Solarian League.

Or Maya, for that matter. Maya & Beowulf will be far more familiar with the astropolitical dynamics of the vast area of space formerly under the jurisdiction of the League, except maybe Manticore. But even with Manticore's extensive reach via her merchant marine & the wormhole network, she's never really had to worry about building up a serious intelligence network to cover all of League space before now. Maya and Beowulf will know where all the bodies are buried, so to speak, or at the very least they would have a far better understanding of the internal workings of the political dynamics and relationships pertaining at the secondary level within the former League (the level of the League's former member worlds and systems) than anyone else in the GA.

Theemile wrote:So true, but without the BF to hammer any offenders, will it survive? It might as well be a rule from the Roman empire, it will have no teeth, and no consensus of others.

Will all the remaining powers sign an Eradaini Compact at some point in the future to return teeth to it? Because it is such an important principle, as you mention, will it even be needed because everybody sees this principle rationally and will abide by it's spirit inhierently without an agreement to do so?

I don't know if/when the GA will formally propose or adopt their version of the Edict, but it's in their clear self-interest to enforce something like it (whether they formally announce it ahead of the first atrocity they encounter or not)

And fortunately the forces you need for a single punitive mission are vastly fewer than you'd need to try to proactively police the galaxy. (But yes, there may still be the occasional minor violation that nobody with the power to retaliate hears about; but that happened under the Edict as well; for example Masada had effectively gotten away with using nukes against Grayson's surface during their last war)


For that matter you need to be kind of nuts to try it in the first place, because you're taking the risk that any remaining military forces of your victim might be able to pull off a revenge strike of their own. Even a single hijacked freighter that makes it into low orbit unsuspected is plenty to pull of megadeaths if the perpetrators are willing to die...
One of the purposes of the Edict is to ensure enough firepower is brought in response to a violation that the response can be more measured to another atrocity in revenge.