Heavy Tri-barrels

Theemile wrote:And I'm trying to point out that the mass of the launcher does not matter from a newtonian point of view - a lighter launcher just means that the launcher recoils with a higher velocity - the projectile launched still has the same initial velocity for the same KE put in the system.

True, the mass of the pod doesn't matter as long as you don't mind launching the pod faster than you do the missiles.

Lord Skimper wrote:The Barrett M109 is the replacement AMR for the now M107 sniper rifle.

It fires a 25mm round.

Unlike the Steyr IWS 2000 which is a flat trajectory high velocity weapon the M109 is a brute force light cannon. Both do a similar job, the Barrett is better for soft target fighting the Steyr for long range anti armour / sniper with variable conditions. Both work, overkill vs infantry, pretty much the same but the Barrett can use explosive anti infantry / soft target ammunition options.

The IWS is pretty useless against a tent full of provisions.

The XM109 is an addition to the Barrett line of extreme range military rifles, and is in 25mm, but I'm not sure that it is intended as a "replacement". Barrett continues to have a variety of rifles, in several calibers, in their line-up.

For one thing, the XM109 is almost 10lb heavier than the M107A1. If it was intended as a "replacement" for an identical mission set, that increase would fly in the face of the substantial user organization feedback which caused Barrett to completely re-engineer the M107 into the M107A1, primarily to reduce carry weight.

dreamrider

OP here. Sorry, I was a bit drunk in my original post. Some people car surf when drunk, apparently I worry about Tri-barrels.

Anyway, I did some further research when sober and found that the "Heavy Tri-Barrel" is actually the standard one used by power armor troops and weapon emplacements according to House of Steel.

With this in mind, I think we can surmise that the Light Tri-barrel is the one used by people outside of battle armor. I guess this serves the roll as squad support weapon, although I'm not sure why you'd need it if the rifles have Full-Auto capability.

I can't figure out what the medium Tri-barrel is for though. They definitely have them though as they're listed on the inventory list for the Peep Assault shuttle in Jaynes.

With all that said, I still have no idea about calibers. I was going by the Honorverse Wiki which lists only a single tri-barrel which is 4mm and 5mm for the Manticorans and Haven.

This is spotty information, for sure but I'd love to know the context of the numbers. Does anyone know where in the books they state the caliber of any tri-barrels? I'd love reverse engineer this number based on context or contexts.

Weird Harold wrote:
True, the mass of the pod doesn't matter as long as you don't mind launching the pod faster than you do the missiles.

Eh? The pod is stated to be heavier than the missiles combined even by itself. That makes your above claim impossible to achieve by default.

And like i said before, if you only launch a single missile at a time, rapidly chainfiring them, the total force applied is still the same, but only the last missile interacts only with the mass of the pod by itself.

And if the pod is 30 times the mass of the missile, then the missile is accelerated 30 times the speed of the pod, in opposite directions.

Tenshinai wrote:Eh? The pod is stated to be heavier than the missiles combined even by itself.

Stated where?

Okay, so I located a reference to the Light Tri-barrel being the "Heaviest man portable weapon in existence" so that must mean the Medium Tri-barrel is not man portable. Perhaps it's a Tri-barrel optimized to be carried by non-power armored troops, and then set up in the field, whereas the Heavy tri-barrel is designed for use in power armor.

Weird Harold wrote:

Tenshinai wrote:Eh? The pod is stated to be heavier than the missiles combined even by itself.

Stated where?

Thought it might have been HAE, chapter 33 - but can't find a weight.

However there is this tidbit:

The pod was smaller than a LAC, but it was much larger than a pinnace, and its designers had been far less concerned with ease of handling than combat effectiveness.

Weight of the pods is, iirc, determined from some of David's comments about the weapon load fraction and the mass of the ship and the number of pods it can hold.

WLBjork wrote:However there is this tidbit:

The pod was smaller than a LAC, but it was much larger than a pinnace, and its designers had been far less concerned with ease of handling than combat effectiveness.

That would be first or second generation pods then? Not the most recent flat-pack or Apollo pods?

Those pods hold Mk 27 Mod C missiles:

HAE wrote:Wayfarer was equipped with the latest Mark 27, Mod C, which weighed in at just over one hundred and twenty tons in one standard gravity.

Those pods also hold ten missiles or 1,200 tons of missiles.

Five complete salvoes spilled astern, ejecting cleanly from the outsized cargo doors, and the pods' onboard fire control was programmed for delayed activation. The first salvo waited forty-eight seconds, the second thirty-six, the third twenty-four, and the fourth twelve . . .

The last fired on launch, and three hundred capital missiles streaked straight into the privateers' teeth.

(six pods/salvo from a Trojan class Q-Ship.)

The problem is that I can't find any specs on the mass of any model Pinnance. The Series 282 LACs mass ~~17,000 tons.

Weird Harold wrote:
That would be first or second generation pods then? Not the most recent flat-pack or Apollo pods?

Those pods hold Mk 27 Mod C missiles:

HAE wrote:Wayfarer was equipped with the latest Mark 27, Mod C, which weighed in at just over one hundred and twenty tons in one standard gravity.

Those pods also hold ten missiles or 1,200 tons of missiles.

Five complete salvoes spilled astern, ejecting cleanly from the outsized cargo doors, and the pods' onboard fire control was programmed for delayed activation. The first salvo waited forty-eight seconds, the second thirty-six, the third twenty-four, and the fourth twelve . . .

The last fired on launch, and three hundred capital missiles streaked straight into the privateers' teeth.

(six pods/salvo from a Trojan class Q-Ship.)

The problem is that I can't find any specs on the mass of any model Pinnance. The Series 282 LACs mass ~~17,000 tons.

You're also are a little back - Mk 27s are single drive capacitor Capitol missiles as of ~1910. (You are quoting fron HaE, before the MDM revolution and Buttercup) Those were never fitted into a flatpack - The current Missiles are the mk 23D fusion MDM. We know of at least 2 intermediate capital missiles between what you are mentioning and what is now fielded - The Mk 41 Capacitor MDM which was a huge beast, and the mk 23 A-C Fusion MDM (Pre apollo).

As of last mentioned, there are been 19 different marks of RMN Pods, with the Mk 17 (iirc) being the first flatpack.

The most current #s we get for pod masses comes from the Medusa B "Spring style" sheet on the Pearls (which is down atm) - iirc, the total pod mass was given, as well as the # of pods. Given that we know the pre-Apollo flatpack mentioned in the spring style carried 12 mk 23 missiles, we can get a decent view on pod mass, though we have no idea what the mk-23 masses.

Oh, and a pinnance's mass won't help you - they are 250-300 tons (Jayne's RMN gives the mk 27 Condor a mass of ~260). Since we know each missile masses 120 tons or more, the pinnance's mass is pointless data.