New Manty ship ideas.

GofyTomcat1 wrote:Is it feasible to have a CA (Sag. C)size vessel with heavier bow chase armament (similar to a Shrike LAC)but with primarily MDM armament for use as a stand off missile platform?

The idea would be to fire missiles ahead of a LAC launch, damaging an enemy vessel and allowing higher LAC survivability. Of course, the vessel would still have a decent broadside for use as a conventional CA.

Probably, but why? Any ship in the RMN can fire both broadsides at literally any angle. Plus, RMN ships are designed with the self-tractering flat pack pod in mind. The GSN has all of the same advantages. The RHN's LACs are space superiority platforms, not for attacking. Nobody else has an LAC that could survive, pretty much regardless of what you did to soften up the target short of damage to the point where the LAC is unnecessary.

If you are going to use a SagC sized ship, why not just use the Sag C with the quadruple broadsides it was designed to handle?

GofyTomcat1 wrote:Is it feasible to have a CA (Sag. C)size vessel with heavier bow chase armament (similar to a Shrike LAC)but with primarily MDM armament for use as a stand off missile platform?

With off-bore capability in Saganami-C and all new RMN designs, it isn't necessary to increase chase launchers; a double broadside does more to make LAC strikes survivable than anything limited to chasers (except for Roland class DDs because they only have chase missile tubes.)

Sneak Moriarty laser head missile platforms with many laserhead rods. 90? Lasing rods going off at point blank range. Up the kilt / down the throat one such platform per ship should make short work of any traditional enemy. Would also kill or remove from combat any SD(P).

Lord Skimper wrote:Sneak Moriarty laser head missile platforms with many laserhead rods. 90? Lasing rods going off at point blank range. Up the kilt / down the throat one such platform per ship should make short work of any traditional enemy. Would also kill or remove from combat any SD(P).

I think you mean Mistletoe. Moriarty platforms are immobile and thus hard to position to attack an enemy. Mistletoe drones are recon drones with nuke or laser warheads first deployed to take out Moriarty. And what makes you think a Mistletoe drone can fit anything near that many lasing rods into its warhead space?

Weird Harold wrote:

GofyTomcat1 wrote:Is it feasible to have a CA (Sag. C)size vessel with heavier bow chase armament (similar to a Shrike LAC)but with primarily MDM armament for use as a stand off missile platform?

With off-bore capability in Saganami-C and all new RMN designs, it isn't necessary to increase chase launchers; a double broadside does more to make LAC strikes survivable than anything limited to chasers (except for Roland class DDs because they only have chase missile tubes.)

Chase armament of PD / CM with a dual (one each end) SD class graser might work. The problem comes in with surviving long enough to use it. Using SD class multiple PD instead may be better. Add in a Roland like configuration but with CM might be better. Off bore firing gives full coverage.

Having a keyhole ship large Frigate small DD with telemetry enhancements along for the ride with similar to nat turner / shrike B (double) armament and a hyper drive. Allowing any ship which doesn't have keyhole to use keyhole, also can move in close for LAC type graseraction. But you would almost never attempt this with a CA. BCL or above sure but the CA is just to weak and important to get that close.

Given the Large progression and seemingly unwillingness to expand the DR SD roles perhaps a BBL or Super SBC might have a use. 7-8.5 mega ton range. Full MDM armament. Limited LAC armoured connections similar to kelhole connections. Full SD sized but limited Grasers. As many tubes as can be squeezed in and full PD CM capabilities of a SD(P). Full Armour and then some. Carry 6 Katana for further defensive shielding. Add full wall of battle enhancement, and increase initial pod fire telemetry. While further enhancing the defensive fire / shielding survivability until pods are empty then continuing the offensive actions using the 100 some tubes of full MDM it carries. 4-5 salvos will empty everyone's pods. At which point if they and you have survived either luck is a factor or suddenly a defense has been found (perhaps a SBC).

100+ tubes are enough to keep the follow up fire withering without compromising the design of the SD(P). Initially tubes would not be fired concentrating on defensive actions and added telemetry for draining the pods. Donkey pods might be carried with full system pods in a money no object attack again doing this isn't such a big deal as the SBC can tow as many as a SD(P). Unlike the vulnerable CLAC it doesn't have to hold back or flee if confronted, it likewise doesn't additional ships on single ship missions. It does it all better even than a Nike BCL. It can be used although as a bit of overkill in peace time, carrying out smaller ship functions. Unlike the SD(P) which are really just wartime vessels. During peacetime 6 shrike can carry out customs actions with full assault shuttle back ups.

For the wall of battle the SBC adds defensive fire more than any other ship. 6 Katana more than the Invictus. Further enhances the wall of battle with full tube launched MDM and carries a full donkey load of pods. May carry either a standard keyhole II or a larger keyhole III which mounts CM in a Roland type chase mount. For further defensive heavy deployment. Adding full telemetry of a SD(P) for draining pods and increasing salvo size. Operates in the wall from the enemies POV it is another SD(P). No extra targets that get concentrated o to remove defensive enhancements.

After the active warfare it further can be used as any smaller traditional craft. Made to operate with a light crew not using all features and capablities. One could even have armoured hatched tube covers graser covers that slide into place like a Q ship but not being a Q ship. It is a full Escort ship Customs ship operating alone to everywhere from freighter escort in backwater are as with reduced crew or with full crew in the latest wall of battle.

Modular internal layouts with ease of refit built into the design to keep it current. Quick connection layout that are slotted into place with in weeks, designed and built ahead of time and carried out either in the field or a full slip, depending on what they are. A deepdock / repair ship can dock and repair replace damaged or updated components pretty much anywhere. No need for extensive refits and down time. A week floating in unnamed space with escorts and the new compensator is in place up and running.

Why have this? Because a means to protect the wall of battle is needed. LAC help but getting them into and out of engagements is risky. CLAC are big targets and with 50 SBC you can move 300 LAC with out the risk of bringing in 3 or 4 CLAC targets. All your eggs in one big basket is great for freighter actions but makes for messy mistakes in military operations. CLAC should be with pod and other rearming carries kept well back from battles. Escorting repair ships rearming ships and not brought into harms way. They are a ferry and nobody brings a ferry into a naval battle.

Lord Skimper wrote:Given the Large progression and seemingly unwillingness to expand the DR SD roles perhaps a BBL or Super SBC might have a use. 7-8.5 mega ton range. Full MDM armament. Limited LAC armoured connections similar to kelhole connections. Full SD sized but limited Grasers. As many tubes as can be squeezed in and full PD CM capabilities of a SD(P). Full Armour and then some. Carry 6 Katana for further defensive shielding. Add full wall of battle enhancement, and increase initial pod fire telemetry. While further enhancing the defensive fire / shielding survivability until pods are empty then continuing the offensive actions using the 100 some tubes of full MDM it carries. 4-5 salvos will empty everyone's pods. At which point if they and you have survived either luck is a factor or suddenly a defense has been found (perhaps a SBC).

So you want a ship that
-fires MDMs out of internal tubes
-carries a bunch of parasite craft
-carries a couple salvos worth of pods
-is heavily armored
-is in the DN tonnage range

So you basically want the Supership That Does Everything(TM).

How many times are you going to come back with this nonsense?

My theory is that Skimper is actually Pierre Sprey. Constantly spits shit out because he is both incredibly ignorant and ignorant that he is ignorant.

Lord Skimper wrote:Why have this? Because a means to protect the wall of battle is needed. LAC help but getting them into and out of engagements is risky. CLAC are big targets and with 50 SBC you can move 300 LAC with out the risk of bringing in 3 or 4 CLAC targets. All your eggs in one big basket is great for freighter actions but makes for messy mistakes in military operations. CLAC should be with pod and other rearming carries kept well back from battles. Escorting repair ships rearming ships and not brought into harms way. They are a ferry and nobody brings a ferry into a naval battle.

Needless to say, I completely disagree with this notion. CLACs are vulnerable, yes, and should be kept out of the line of fire if at all possible, but you can do that by dropping off the LACs before crossing the hyper limit. No need to invent a new class of ships that compromises its own abilities as a fighting ship by accomodating a bunch of LACs.

Or, you know, you could design your CLACs so that they incorporate all the active defenses of a normal SD(P) (the passive defenses being severely compromised due to the necessities of the CLAC role), plug them into the missile defense nets of the Wall, and get not only the defensive fire from the LACs, but also that of the CLACs to help defend the wall while it throws missiles.

The E wrote:
So you want a ship that
-fires MDMs out of internal tubes
-carries a bunch of parasite craft
-carries a couple salvos worth of pods
-is heavily armored
-is in the DN tonnage range

So you basically want the Supership That Does Everything(TM).

How many times are you going to come back with this nonsense?

You forgot he also wants its interior to be highly modular and easy to reconfigures (so much for heavily armored )