Non-weapons of war, weapons of war

Weird Harold wrote:

Dutch46 wrote:I think you need to take a closer look at what is required to keep a triple expansion engine running. The vaunted reliability of steam stems largely from redundancy and not from the reliability of the multitude of its separate parts.

I don't recall anyone claiming reliability as an advantage for steam power. One reason ICEs took over so completely is the maintenance to operations ratio for steam is so costly. Steam engines can take all day to raise steam, require constant oiling and monitoring, and a host of other tasks to start up or shut down.

What Steam engines offer is maintainability: A decent blacksmith can rebuild almost any part needed.

Steam also offers versatility: external combustion means the boiler can be fired by solid, liquid, or gaseous fuel; everything from buffalo chips to cow farts can fuel a steam engine. (some fuels are obviously better than others. )

In Safehold's case, Steam also can pass the inquisition -- at least a Charisian inquisition.

Steam isn't a permanent solution, but it can fill the gaps until the Go4 is defeated and the Proscriptions can be lifted.

Tenshinai wrote:
SYED wrote:
I don't know why but the inquisitors forced to go after books with talking dragons make me laugh.




That might just hurt their reputation a wee bit...


Yeah, I have trouble imagining inquisitors confiscating copies of "Clifford the Big Red Dog"

Weird Harold wrote:

Dutch46 wrote:I think you need to take a closer look at what is required to keep a triple expansion engine running. The vaunted reliability of steam stems largely from redundancy and not from the reliability of the multitude of its separate parts.

I don't recall anyone claiming reliability as an advantage for steam power. One reason ICEs took over so completely is the maintenance to operations ratio for steam is so costly. Steam engines can take all day to raise steam, require constant oiling and monitoring, and a host of other tasks to start up or shut down.

What Steam engines offer is maintainability: A decent blacksmith can rebuild almost any part needed.

Steam also offers versatility: external combustion means the boiler can be fired by solid, liquid, or gaseous fuel; everything from buffalo chips to cow farts can fuel a steam engine. (some fuels are obviously better than others. )

In Safehold's case, Steam also can pass the inquisition -- at least a Charisian inquisition.

Steam isn't a permanent solution, but it can fill the gaps until the Go4 is defeated and the Proscriptions can be lifted.

Dutch46 wrote:A diesel will run on anything that combusts at the temperature that the compression generates. The only problem is getting it into the cylinder at the right time and in the right quantity. There have been diesels that have been run on dried sewage solids. Boilers have a number of drawbacks for mobile applications such as trucks that make diesel propulsion preferable. for stationary applications, steam is fine.

AirTech wrote:Big diesels need maintenance too, the major advantage of a diesel over a stem engine is the one to three hours needed to build the fire in the boiler, up to the point where the boiler pressure is ready for service, ...

Tenshinai wrote:Like i said before, if gaslights can get by, then ICE probably can.

Weird Harold wrote:

Tenshinai wrote:Like i said before, if gaslights can get by, then ICE probably can.

Gaslights are simply an extension of "burning things provide light." "City Gas" is "just coal in another form." Gaslights don't really introduce any new technology, they're simply adaptations of traditional lanterns to a central fuel supply.

I'm not sure how you stretch "burning things provide light" to "burning things in a cylinder provides power." There's no logical connection between the operating principles of gaslights and ICEs.

Tenshinai wrote:You can run ICE on the exact same gas. Then you´re just burning the gas inside a cylinder instead of a lamp. How is that NOT a logical connection?

AirTech wrote:

Weird Harold wrote:**quote="Dutch46"**I think you need to take a closer look at what is required to keep a triple expansion engine running. The vaunted reliability of steam stems largely from redundancy and not from the reliability of the multitude of its separate parts.**/quote**

I don't recall anyone claiming reliability as an advantage for steam power. One reason ICEs took over so completely is the maintenance to operations ratio for steam is so costly. Steam engines can take all day to raise steam, require constant oiling and monitoring, and a host of other tasks to start up or shut down.

What Steam engines offer is maintainability: A decent blacksmith can rebuild almost any part needed.

Steam also offers versatility: external combustion means the boiler can be fired by solid, liquid, or gaseous fuel; everything from buffalo chips to cow farts can fuel a steam engine. (some fuels are obviously better than others. )

In Safehold's case, Steam also can pass the inquisition -- at least a Charisian inquisition.

Steam isn't a permanent solution, but it can fill the gaps until the Go4 is defeated and the Proscriptions can be lifted.

Big diesels need maintenance too, the major advantage of a diesel over a stem engine is the one to three hours needed to build the fire in the boiler, up to the point where the boiler pressure is ready for service, in the morning - a step a diesel can skip - and as this adds around two hours minimum to the paid day of the fireman is a significant cost to the operation of a railroad as does removing the ash from the firebox and smokebox. Steam engines and diesels are similar for efficiency (with a slight margin in favor of a compound condensing steam engine), turbocharged diesels work better than steam engines in cold and high enviroments and steam engines require marginally less maintenance (due to fewer moving parts) -
new build steam engines have been considered for a number of applications but the required infrastructure is now lacking in most places.

lyonheart wrote:Hi AirTech,

I remember about 30 years ago when when they replaced 1300 HP RR steam engines that had been operation the better part of a century in Bolivia and Peru, with diesels of similar power and discovered they didn't work too well at that altitude, so they wound up replacing the 1300HP diesels with 3000 HP diesels to match what the steam engines had been doing with far less fuss and expense for decades.