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VISUALIZATION OF HONOR

Discussion concerning the TV, film, and comic adaptations.
Re: (STICKY) VISUALIZATION OF HONOR
Post by Werrf   » Sun Feb 23, 2014 10:16 am

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This is actually really, really good to see, and it makes a lot of my earlier fears quite evaporate :)

I actually also like the rationalisation behind the belt buckle given above - the idea of tech routinely incorporated into everyday clothing really fits the Honorverse, though I don't think it needs to be as obtrusive as the big belt buckle, so I'm glad to see that going away.

Of the designs here, three and four look fantastic. It does kind of look as though you may be trying to combine uniform and skinsuit into a single design, and I can get behind that for simplicity's sake if nothing else - two different uniforms for the same character could be confusing in fast-paced battle sequences, and leaves more room for continuity errors. I can also rationalise wanting to use blue rather than black, since black can be difficult to clearly portray in comic books and games (hence why Batman's suit is frequently drawn in grey), so going with a nice deep blue makes sense.

But more important than anything, it's clear in these images that our voices and concerns were heard, and addressed, and that's something I don't think any other fandom can say at this stage of a production. It's really, really great to see :)
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Re: (STICKY) VISUALIZATION OF HONOR
Post by Borealis   » Mon Feb 24, 2014 12:51 pm

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First, thank you Evergreen for posting your concept art. As previously mentioned, your showing the evolution and how it incorporates our many comments and suggests is greatly appreciated.

Your renderings for #3 and #4 are particularly good, and choosing which I like better is actually pretty difficult. I do think #3 squeaks ahead though. The overall darker color is closer to the canon black, while the red accents bring a bit more color to what is definitely a graphic media.

My only suggestion would be to give it more of a two-piece look, with the top being the often described tunic. The one-piece look, to me, is a little too sci-fi trendy. However, I might overlook that if the plan is to have this uniform incorporated into the skin-suit to save uniform changes. If this is the case, showing this with a helmet might help solidify the look.

Personally, I'd like to see a separate skinsuit since that might help change the overall graphical 'look' from normal operations to combat stations, but that's just me.

Again, thank you for sharing this concept art, and I look forward to seeing more of your offerings as it becomes available. (Hint, a reasonably close rendering of the starships. Preferably with more than one star-nation to provide comparisons...)
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Re: (STICKY) VISUALIZATION OF HONOR
Post by pilotus   » Mon Feb 24, 2014 4:04 pm

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#3 is very interesting. stylish minimalism. a low bow to your designer. I know, believe me, as it was hard done.

Now about my wishes (you allow me?). I would prefer a less tight form. Jacket with a coat-breast (this is the correct term?), like in the good old Navy :)

And another strap with simple buckle - decorates waist. If I were a designer clothes Manticore navy, then surely me girded officers thin graceful belt. :)

PS I posted this message, and only then realized that I simply like more strict classic costume (option #2), not athletic fitted (#3)
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Re: (STICKY) VISUALIZATION OF HONOR
Post by Star Knight   » Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:45 am

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Oh look, actual uniforms. Nice.

No seriously, huge improvement over the comic book stuff.
#3 is the best version IMO with rank insignias, shoulder marks and everything.
but #2 has better designed clothes, its a uniform of a serious navy, not frigging Star Trek.
And please please, loose the blue and make the uniforms black. #3 almost works, just add to that.
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Re: (STICKY) VISUALIZATION OF HONOR
Post by hvb   » Tue Feb 25, 2014 1:24 pm

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As many others (from reply #1 onwards) have opined, #3 has better coloration, #4 is better in other elements, #2 has the best fit.

In particular:
#2: Looseness of cut is best here.
#3: Colors are truer (albeit not black, the uniform is a very dark blue); shoulder boards, collar pips and other insignia are included respectively rendered best here.
#4: Beret! The Gold is far lighter here; the sleeve stripes look more like a real-world uniform’s. Boots are more (maybe over?) elaborate here though.

No one else has mentioned it IIRC; but in #4 the belt buckle has, it seems, become an object at the throat. Which seems a better position for it to me; in both locations during use the hand/arm will intermittently occlude the line of sight between the device and a hologram displayed in front of the wearer’s face, but in the throat location, the occlusion would mostly already be occluded by the hand anyway (you cannot see a key as you are stroking it).


For my money’s worth (aka for all 47* of 47 rows of apple trees): Keeping the Gold & Beret of #4, transfer over the other Colors and Insignia of #3 (or better yet with dark blue replaced with Black), and this would be an ideal "uniform/Navy skinsuit combo", if you must use such* ...

... well, that last row only if the ‘pelvic paired inverted chevrons’ were flipped to point upwards towards the pair on the chest. (Is it only me, or do they look to be subtly drawing attention to points south of the navel?) :oops:


*: If a separate skinsuit is contemplated, loosen the uniform a bit, #2 has been suggested as a guide by several (and if not, Top Cow’s Marine skinsuit probably looks way too different from the Navy one ... although it has the issue of a face mask in place of a translucent visor anyway).
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Re: (STICKY) VISUALIZATION OF HONOR
Post by Crown Loyalist   » Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:36 pm

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I'd take the shoulder epaulets from #3 and tack them onto #4, make them gold, then darken the uniform blue as far to black as you're willing to go. In part, because there needs to be a contrast between Manticoran and Grayson uniforms, and the Graysons wear blue. Then I'd suggest loosening the outfit altogether, so that it's not as skintight.

I'd also suggest making the uniform front less "busy". It's more a business suit than a hockey jersey. The gold trim doesn't need to directly track down her legs like it's a single-piece outfit.

Edit: wait. I guess that depends on what we're looking at. Uniforms aren't, for instance, worn in combat, skinsuits are. If this is a combination skinsuit-uniform then my previous paragraph suddenly becomes largely irrelevant, and you'd want the one-piece hockey jersey rather than the business suit. For a skinsuit-uniform I actually really like both #3 and #4, although I'd still make slight coloration changes.

If this is, however, her dress uniform - the kind of thing she's wear to the dinner party at the beginning of Honor of the Queen, or to her dinner with Protector Benjamin - then not so much.
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Re: (STICKY) VISUALIZATION OF HONOR
Post by Brigade XO   » Tue Feb 25, 2014 7:32 pm

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I think 3 or 4 would be good for the sknsuit but not for regular duty uniforms. Perhaps the rank and other markings of 3 (are those two red stripes on 3 wound stripes?) on 4?

#1 looks like a fashion model sketch, not something you are going to put a working military person into.
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Re: (STICKY) VISUALIZATION OF HONOR
Post by Crown Loyalist   » Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:42 pm

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Brigade XO wrote:I think 3 or 4 would be good for the sknsuit but not for regular duty uniforms. Perhaps the rank and other markings of 3 (are those two red stripes on 3 wound stripes?) on 4?


I was thinking much the same, but then I realized that (not unreasonably) it appears they're combining shipboard-duty uniforms with skinsuits (hopefully they'll still have an independent dress uniform). This makes sense in a visual medium.
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Re: (STICKY) VISUALIZATION OF HONOR
Post by Spacekiwi   » Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:56 pm

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Personally, on ship I always thought it kind of weird they werent wearing skinsuits pretty much constantly. You are in a working envionment with the hazard of being in space, so wearing protective equipment is a smart thig. Since that equipment is also uniform, really it should be the permanent space uniform.
Crown Loyalist wrote:
Brigade XO wrote:I think 3 or 4 would be good for the sknsuit but not for regular duty uniforms. Perhaps the rank and other markings of 3 (are those two red stripes on 3 wound stripes?) on 4?


I was thinking much the same, but then I realized that (not unreasonably) it appears they're combining shipboard-duty uniforms with skinsuits (hopefully they'll still have an independent dress uniform). This makes sense in a visual medium.
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Re: (STICKY) VISUALIZATION OF HONOR
Post by Chyort   » Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:41 pm

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I also Kinda like #3 more than #4.

But mostly i am just glad to see the progress that has been made so far in a sort of timeline i guess.

Cant wait to see similar on Nimitz, and the ships. :)

More... "This is where we started, and where we are now, and what would you like to see next."

Makes me glad i reserved judgment after looking at the early concept art. :P
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