Thorium powered car

It has only been in the last year(2). Way to go guys! Of course it is the new breakthrough thin films... sub 20% efficient instead of old 10% eff thin films.

They still don't quite have it down as it still requires a hole through the roof in multiple spots, not exactly something one wishes to contemplate, but not necessarily the end of the world either. Now if they create a major wire that clipped into their end clips creating a main power feed harness that would extend upwards to the roof peak and then duck the wires under instead at the end of each row, then we would be talking. Take it out the edge of the roof and into the attic etc... So, steep roofs only currently. Still better than nothing.

$30,000 for around ?kW... Generally, in solar guys this means around 2kW-4kW max. Um yea... but quite of bit of that will be labor. Do it yourself probably drops it down to around $15,000 assuming they will even let you buy them without an "approved" contractor. Last time I tried to buy the "good" solar panels(not shingles) they told me NO. I gave them the finger at Pratt Electric and moved on.

See, now this is why I enter forums like this. Just because I have looked in the past doesn't mean time doesn't march on leaving my old research in the dust.

Anyways these are hands down vastly superior to solar panels.

I have to wonder how long they last in the sun though... That thin film still has to take the UV day after day after day... I note DOW etc "conveniently" forget to mention this "minor" fact. Means they are hiding something if you asked me. EDIT: Did a little digging. Say anywhere from 20 to 40 years. So that means 20... if you are lucky and live in New Mexico where they get no rain and likewise have low humidity. My bet is that the contacts between panels corrode and die requiring an effective "reroof". Panels may still be just fine, but the contacts die.

PPS. What is sad is due to all of our moron regulations and labor union thugism, even DOW can't afford to manufacture them here in the USA or W. Europe. Instead we "assemble" them here. How pathetic is that? All the real high tech fabs are in China. War will be short and ugly with us on the losing end. Big time. No manufacturing due to our populations selling the hangman rope combined with less manpower. Only ICBM nukes will keep us relevant. No one will wake up till get they get smacked so hard they have to admit they were all a bunch of greedy selfish fools. That goes for the workers and CEO's alike.

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Spacekiwi wrote:the ones that have apparently been around since 2011?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_shingle


http://www.dowpowerhouse.com/

Apparently they take less time to install, but im unable to find a price comparison at the moment, or the effective energy output comparison. still, its a start towards invisible power generators. the fact they are not sticking out of the roof will probably encourage more people to buy them, as they wont affect pereceptions of the houses asthetics anymore.

Relax wrote:
Yup, all of the do as I say, not as I do crowd.

My favorite joke, is that if greenies were truly wanting to be green they would be doing everything in their power to push people towards heat pump systems by severely cutting regulations regarding their installation(union HVAC reqs, and union well drillers). Cuts your heating bill in half at a minimum. Closer to 75%. Now you down in Aussie land, would get less use from a Heat pump system unless you lived in/near the snowy mountains. The rest of humanity who mostly live in cooler climates would benefit greatly. Ah, but ignorance is bliss to the say as I do, so I can get your vote, not as I do crowd.

Still waiting on solar shingles. Until then, solar is a joke as they really are not serious about making it applicable as an energy solution. Effectively Paying for "2" roofs is untenable financially.

While i admit i might not have research the thorium car as carefully as i should have, i in no means meant it as a bad idea as i do agree with you guys that we DO have to get away from fossil fuels both in cars and in power plants with alternatives.

Here is one item that popped up recently that MAY offer a way to find a way to get vehicles with alternative power sources on the market more than they are now. http://news.vanderbilt.edu/2013/10/devi ... con-chips/

That stuff has been around for 30-40 years in a ton of different scenarios. It is a common paper put out by materials science departments of different universities. Everyone can do it. While a learning experience for someone who has never done it before, who knows, someone might finally figure it out, it doesn't mean anything.

"Just around the corner". Kinda like silicon carbide batteries, fibers, bucky balls, etc.

The problem is that ALL of these doped materials require them to grown/doped at the same time.

Anyone can make a single film "capacitor" or "battery" or super fiber(500,000psi tensile fibers). None of which does anyone any good. Have to be able to grow a whole "block" of said stuff. If when this happens, THEN and only THEN will a quantum leap occur in application to super conductors. Super capacitors. Super batteries. etc

Thorium fueled reactors are quite safe and possible using the "molten salt" reactor. These are quit passive and don't require the complex control electronics, cooling circuits and so on that mean most reactors need teams of highly skilled tech staff to run. Indeed, small ones have been considered that could be "nuclear batteries", garbage can sized units sunk in a concrete block and quietly producing energy for 20 years or so for your city block.

http://www.technologyreview.com/news/51 ... the-price/ for an overview of molten salt technology in general

viciokie wrote:While i admit i might not have research the thorium car as carefully as i should have, i in no means meant it as a bad idea as i do agree with you guys that we DO have to get away from fossil fuels both in cars and in power plants with alternatives.

As nameless said, should be all nuclear power also producing hydrogen gas for transportation. IE splitting water. Besides the steel industry would LOVE such a scenario as it would make freely available oxygen essentially FREE. Rocket industry would love it as well.

I posted a while back about solar. Efficiency, costs to buy per kW and so forth. I'm not going to dig it up now, but if you're interested you can go look. The long and short of it is that even the best solar systems, most efficient with the best paying rates of power companies, take about 10 years to earn back the investment. You get another 10 years, maybe, of life out of them.

That's best case scenario. Realistically, you're looking at 15-20 years to pay off the cost. Just as they start breaking. AND that's factoring in federal/state incentives to use solar. Which have begun dropping off these last few years.

On the heat pump comment earlier, they are good, for a wide variety of areas. But if it's too hot or too cold, they're really not much use. I.E. most places north of the Mason-Dixon line really hit the depths of winter and can't use a heat pump effectively. Oh, it can be used, but efficiency really drops off. And when you get into northern NY or other places that spend much of the winter at single digits and lower? Well, the heat pump's only viable in the spring and fall for heat.

Fireflair wrote:On the heat pump comment earlier, they are good, for a wide variety of areas. But if it's too hot or too cold, they're really not much use. I.E. most places north of the Mason-Dixon line really hit the depths of winter and can't use a heat pump effectively. Oh, it can be used, but efficiency really drops off. And when you get into northern NY or other places that spend much of the winter at single digits and lower? Well, the heat pump's only viable in the spring and fall for heat.

You are wrong for where they are valuable, as the "line" you gave is only true for Ohio etc and even then Southern half of Ohio, Indiana this is not true. Of course it bulges southward in W. Virginia, and once again go north on the Eastern Seaboard. If all you are doing is turning around an AC then yes, you are right. If one actually builds one for heating, larger condensor, then all those regions you just poo-poo'd, they become far preferable, and below the mason dixon line becomes highly problematical as the difference between ground temperature and air temperature is greater and therefore the greater effiiciency. Yes, when it is below freezing 24/7 one does have the condensor freeze up, requiring a larger condensor.

You must have a 15F-20F difference for it to work and only for a very small portion of the year below the mason dixon line does this temperature variation exist. Of course that portion of the year that region needs heat so... How many months is that though? 3? Makes it un economical down south. High plains like Colorado, it is once again wonderful as the low humidity makes the condensor size shrink(ice build up).

My mother has a large outside furnace with water lines running into her house. It heats her hot water heater, then runs along the first floor subfloor to heat the house. Pretty efficient, just a wood burning furnace outside. She lives in VA, in an area where the power goes out any time it storms badly or snows decently.

She also has a retention pond and a hydro set up. Works fairly well, except in winter when the pond and streams freeze up.

What I have seen home owners in the northern states do, regarding heat pumps, is to have one, with the large condenser. But also to have a natural gas back up as well.

On the heat pump comment earlier, they are good, for a wide variety of areas. But if it's too hot or too cold, they're really not much use. I.E. most places north of the Mason-Dixon line really hit the depths of winter and can't use a heat pump effectively. Oh, it can be used, but efficiency really drops off. And when you get into northern NY or other places that spend much of the winter at single digits and lower? Well, the heat pump's only viable in the spring and fall for heat.

This is an example of why there never will be any one solution, but rather a large number of solutions driven by local conditions. One size fits all doesn't fit!

Heatpumps work just fine in Soutwestern Ontario, which is north of Michigan and New York State. Air to air heatpumps do have issues, but most installations around here use the ground or a pond as part of the circuit, giving a large heat sink/reservoir to work with.