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The Temple—How might it be taken?

This fascinating series is a combination of historical seafaring, swashbuckling adventure, and high technological science-fiction. Join us in a discussion!
Re: The Temple—How might it be taken?
Post by n7axw   » Fri Oct 02, 2015 2:05 pm

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C. O. Thompson wrote:Don... fun? Remind me not to put you on the committee that is planing my next party :idea:




Actually, on your team you would need at least one person capable of hacking a computer or perhaps infiltrating a computer with a specially designed virus or worm.

Merlin and Nimue can't do it because of their PICA power packs.

That would mean taking the brightest, most qualified person you can come up with to the cave for extensive training.

Everybody else on the ops team would be there for the purpose of tending to the security of that individual...

Don


OK Don, I agree that there needs to be someone with the abilities to "hack' into the system.

Maybe a variation of the VR suit that Owl made after s/he and Narmhan did some research into the old files would provide a basic model NEAT to train up a member of the team.

Only God and David Weber know and they ain't telling me. :?
I think we all agree that this tough nut must be cracked... it may be easier said than done but, if you can state your problem in logical terms, you can solve the problem. We don't always get the results we expected and the cost is sometimes higher than we wanted it to be but--

I will be surprised if we see it done in this book or if it is, it will be in the last chapter.

13 days and the odd number of hours and counting down.

Just my two cents

One further thought... We don't know that the computer in question is even in the basement of the Temple. It could be that all that's there is a terminal accessing another computer squirreled away in a cave like Owl is. Wouldn't that be fun?

Don
[/quote][/quote]

Do you really need committees to plan your parties? I'd like to see the results of that....please, an invitation! :lol:

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
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SPOILER Re: The Temple—How might it be taken?
Post by Randomiser   » Fri Oct 02, 2015 4:30 pm

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shaeun wrote:
We have no idea what happened after he left, and his body still being intact after all these years raises a couple of questions and implies some interesting possibilities.



There is no evidence or suggestion that the body is intact. The tomb is intact. We know nothing more.
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Re: The Temple—How might it be taken?
Post by Thendisnia   » Fri Oct 02, 2015 5:51 pm

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n7axw wrote:Actually, on your team you would need at least one person capable of hacking a computer or perhaps infiltrating a computer with a specially designed virus or worm.

Merlin and Nimue can't do it because of their PICA power packs.

That would mean taking the brightest, most qualified person you can come up with to the cave for extensive training.

Everybody else on the ops team would be there for the purpose of tending to the security of that individual...

Don


Sounds like Irys has a fun future in this series....
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Re: The Temple—How might it be taken?
Post by C. O. Thompson   » Tue Oct 06, 2015 3:14 pm

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I am rereading Like a Mighty Army to get a running speed start on Hell's Foundations Quiver and reading more in these forums than I have in a while. Here is a possible twist on the locks... it comes from chapter 17 when Staynir is speaking with Garlyng...
He said the Grand Vicar is infallible when he spoke from Langhorn's own throne in accordance with the writ and Gods will.

So what if 'Langhorn's throne is the commanders chair and interface and the "password" is combination of the jeweled scepter and key phrases that activate or shut off what is under the temple. Just like the relics that Paiter has, they significance has been lost.

Of course, even if I am right on this... the allies still have to get to the command chair and say the right things so, maybe this is just an exercise in futility.

Just my two cents




evilauthor wrote:
SWM wrote:There is no evidence that the Temple require high-tech keys or credentials to enter the building. As far as we know, the entrances are currently protected by contemporary defenses. It's not getting into the Temple that poses a problem for Charis--it is getting into Zion.


There's no evidence against either, especially when the Temple has an "Open Door" policy when it comes to pilgrims. When you have a constant flow of traffic going in and out of the Temple, it's simply easier to keep the door open all the time than to shut it when no one's going through at the moment.

But if I were designing the Temple, and if I were as paranoid as the original designers seemed to be, then I'd put lockable doors on the main entrance. If the right emergency came up (a beseiging Charisian army for example), then the only thing needed to close and lock the front doors would be the door guard pressing a few "God Lights" in a panel just inside the doors.

Heck, it wouldn't surprise me if the Temple Guard has actual procedures for how to defend the Temple from attack handed down from the Archangels themselves. They just never expect to actually need to USE them, but they'd be on the books all the same.

And of course, we don't know if they have any of this stuff because the Temple has NEVER come under attack. Yet. So there's been no need so far to do an exposition dump on it.
Just my 2 ₡ worth
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Re: The Temple—How might it be taken?
Post by JeffEngel   » Tue Oct 06, 2015 4:23 pm

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C. O. Thompson wrote:I am rereading Like a Mighty Army to get a running speed start on Hell's Foundations Quiver and reading more in these forums than I have in a while. Here is a possible twist on the locks... it comes from chapter 17 when Staynir is speaking with Garlyng...
He said the Grand Vicar is infallible when he spoke from Langhorn's own throne in accordance with the writ and Gods will.

So what if 'Langhorn's throne is the commanders chair and interface and the "password" is combination of the jeweled scepter and key phrases that activate or shut off what is under the temple. Just like the relics that Paiter has, they significance has been lost.

Of course, even if I am right on this... the allies still have to get to the command chair and say the right things so, maybe this is just an exercise in futility.

Just my two cents

It'd require that Church doctrine - in this case, articulated and re-articulated over the course of doctrinal developments over centuries - was tied to a specific device in the Temple that was not used over the course of those centuries.

I don't think there's reason to believe in that connection. Safehold's doctrine has had plenty of this-worldly pressures to get it where it is now - I would not think it's got another pressure from an archangelic leftover too.
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Re: The Temple—How might it be taken?
Post by noblehunter   » Tue Oct 06, 2015 4:30 pm

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They'd never have gotten gunpowder past the Inquisition if that were true.

It's probably just that the COGA stole the doctrine of papal infallibility from the Catholics. Like the Grand Vicar, the Pope is only infallible when speaking ex cathedra.
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Re: The Temple—How might it be taken?
Post by n7axw   » Tue Oct 06, 2015 8:12 pm

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noblehunter wrote:They'd never have gotten gunpowder past the Inquisition if that were true.

It's probably just that the COGA stole the doctrine of papal infallibility from the Catholics. Like the Grand Vicar, the Pope is only infallible when speaking ex cathedra.


I agree that in all probability that was the source of the idea, but I strongly doubt that it was the COGA that did the stealing (tongue in cheek). :twisted:

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
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Re: The Temple—How might it be taken?
Post by rrw   » Tue Oct 06, 2015 8:35 pm

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An orbital bombardment system (OBS) takes time to arrive at its strike point. Merlin is experiencing grief and world weariness.

If Merlin were to infiltrate the temple, he would probably be detected but probably too late to prevent his entrance. He could deactivate his cloaking, stealth system to ensure he is detected as a forbidden power source once inside the temple. The OBS would destroy the temple and show evidence of the wrath of God.

Precede his infiltration by rumours that cause the local population to flee (those stink bombs in the air vents I read about earlier would also be a nice touch) and loss of innocent live is minimized.

Merlin would of course be destroyed as well, or at least the PICA that is currently active as Merlin.
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Re: The Temple—How might it be taken?
Post by n7axw   » Tue Oct 06, 2015 11:08 pm

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rrw wrote:An orbital bombardment system (OBS) takes time to arrive at its strike point. Merlin is experiencing grief and world weariness.

If Merlin were to infiltrate the temple, he would probably be detected but probably too late to prevent his entrance. He could deactivate his cloaking, stealth system to ensure he is detected as a forbidden power source once inside the temple. The OBS would destroy the temple and show evidence of the wrath of God.

Precede his infiltration by rumours that cause the local population to flee (those stink bombs in the air vents I read about earlier would also be a nice touch) and loss of innocent live is minimized.

Merlin would of course be destroyed as well, or at least the PICA that is currently active as Merlin.


I suppose that something like this could happen. And it is true that Merlin is a bit world weary although sinse Nahrman reamed him a new one, he seems to be doing better. Also, Nimue number two or perhaps three depending how you count has showed up to brighten Merlin's life so he doesn't feel quite so lonely. Kinda like having a sassy kid sister around. So no, as weary as Merlin may occasionally get, I see him following through on his mission to the end. He's not going to suicide.

Then too, the idea isn't to destroy the temple; it's to capture it and get at the computer in the basement.

I would presume that if the OBS is on automatics rather than requiring a manual command, whoever set up the programing made sure that the temple would never be attacked.

The scenario I see as most likely is that the Eoc will transport troops in to seize Zion from the sea into Port Harbor that show up in coordination with a special op of troops disguised as pilgrims armed with edged weapons who infiltrate the Temple just before the troops arrive.

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
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Re: The Temple—How might it be taken?
Post by Expert snuggler   » Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:39 am

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It would take a good cover story to explain a band of pilgrims composed entirely of healthy young men in good physical condition.
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