Charis's spy problem.

Brigade XO wrote:Having The Church's intelegence services dig out some kind of "spy" or at least criminal network selling information surely would divert some of it's attention. That would be rather tough on the people caught but you are not going to deliberatly expose them even if you would perhaps never want to work with them again once the the war with the Church is over except to keep an eye on them for other possible criminal activity. Really iffy line between "our spies" their spies, their people who are spying (and know it) for us and people who are in it for either just the money or any one of a dozen reasons.

Charis, and more specifically Merlin, don't work that way. They would never deliberately send someone into harms way expecting and hoping that they would be captured and tortured.

AirTech wrote:The advantage of a publicly known spy network is that it can provide a cover for unknown sources.

They have a publicly known network, it's the seijin network.

Keith_w wrote:

AirTech wrote:The advantage of a publicly known spy network is that it can provide a cover for unknown sources.

They have a publicly known network, it's the seijin network.

I can't believe that Charis didn't have a spy network prior to Merlin "waking up", and I further find it hard to believe all of the network they did have disappeared. Though doubtless some of them will have come down on the Temple Loyalist front and no longer be talking to Charis, whilst others will either have died or been moved to areas where they are now less productive, or no longer able to communicate with their handlers.

You are all forgetting that Charis did have a global spy network in place before Merlin in addition to the information collected by its merchant fleet. That network has certainly been continued, even though it is no longer necessary. However, I suspect the ability to make reports has been limited by the trade disruptions.

Hildum wrote:You are all forgetting that Charis did have a global spy network in place before Merlin in addition to the information collected by its merchant fleet. That network has certainly been continued, even though it is no longer necessary. However, I suspect the ability to make reports has been limited by the trade disruptions.

Continuing the global spy network would make sense for the same reason that some (less critical) reports have deliberate errors in them. In all contests, it can be important to fake out the opponent. In WWII, didn't they cause a corpse carrying disinformation to reach the NAZIs

DDHv wrote:

Hildum wrote:You are all forgetting that Charis did have a global spy network in place before Merlin in addition to the information collected by its merchant fleet. That network has certainly been continued, even though it is no longer necessary. However, I suspect the ability to make reports has been limited by the trade disruptions.

Continuing the global spy network would make sense for the same reason that some (less critical) reports have deliberate errors in them. In all contests, it can be important to fake out the opponent. In WWII, didn't they cause a corpse carrying disinformation to reach the NAZIs

Yes, launched him from a submarine of the Spanish coast.

DDHv wrote:

Hildum wrote:You are all forgetting that Charis did have a global spy network in place before Merlin in addition to the information collected by its merchant fleet. That network has certainly been continued, even though it is no longer necessary. However, I suspect the ability to make reports has been limited by the trade disruptions.

Continuing the global spy network would make sense for the same reason that some (less critical) reports have deliberate errors in them. In all contests, it can be important to fake out the opponent. In WWII, didn't they cause a corpse carrying disinformation to reach the NAZIs

If you are being really nasty, you could frame up a member of the other side as an active source (retribution can be a bitch). If you pick the right patsy this could be really destabilizing. The drones could do a better job than any human agent at this.

Hildum wrote:You are all forgetting that Charis did have a global spy network in place before Merlin in addition to the information collected by its merchant fleet. That network has certainly been continued, even though it is no longer necessary. However, I suspect the ability to make reports has been limited by the trade disruptions.

They had a spy network, but I'd hardly call it "global". What they had was likely focused on their then-current enemies and other associates, aka, the Out Island kingdoms.

Seriously, the only one of these Out Island powers who might be said to have a truly "global" intelligence network is Hektor of Corrisande. And he only gets a "might" because he put sleeper agents inside the Inquisition!

evilauthor wrote:

Hildum wrote:You are all forgetting that Charis did have a global spy network in place before Merlin in addition to the information collected by its merchant fleet. That network has certainly been continued, even though it is no longer necessary. However, I suspect the ability to make reports has been limited by the trade disruptions.

They had a spy network, but I'd hardly call it "global". What they had was likely focused on their then-current enemies and other associates, aka, the Out Island kingdoms.

Seriously, the only one of these Out Island powers who might be said to have a truly "global" intelligence network is Hektor of Corrisande. And he only gets a "might" because he put sleeper agents inside the Inquisition!

Chrais's spy network was more of a commercial spy network than a military one. That's not to say that there trade representatives didn't report on military matters. Also IIRC most of Charis' merchant ships had ex-navy officers or officers on "sabbatical" like ADM Sarforth when he was younger. Do you think Sarforth wasn't reporting on what happened in Siddar City or Port Harbor or etc.

FYI the maritime insurance company Lloyds of London used to have one of the best nongovernmental intelligence arms in the world. It was made up of primary and secondary agents and sub-agents in most of the world's ports that inspected ships and reported on the comings and goings of ships around the world.

AirTech wrote:

DDHv wrote:Continuing the global spy network would make sense for the same reason that some (less critical) reports have deliberate errors in them. In all contests, it can be important to fake out the opponent. In WWII, didn't they cause a corpse carrying disinformation to reach the NAZIs

If you are being really nasty, you could frame up a member of the other side as an active source (retribution can be a bitch). If you pick the right patsy this could be really destabilizing. The drones could do a better job than any human agent at this.

Already been done, without the need for fancy technology. Amazing what a "slip" of the tongue can accomplish at the right time. See Off Armageddon Reef.