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Steel Thistle silk - uses

This fascinating series is a combination of historical seafaring, swashbuckling adventure, and high technological science-fiction. Join us in a discussion!
Re: Steel Thistle silk - uses
Post by n7axw   » Fri Oct 02, 2015 11:45 pm

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Expert snuggler wrote:It will be a while before every ship is ironclad. Some kind of inner lining to reduce splintering would be a useful safety measure in a wooden ship.


True, but probably not practical at a time when explosive shells can blow holes in wooden ships. Any useful solution would make the liner as heavy as the armor needed to break up the shells on the outside of the ship.

My thought here is that an even more worrisome issue than splinters is having the ship sink after having two and three foot holes blown in the hull at the water line.

The best solution is to get rid of the unarmored wood hulls, but as you point out, that is going to take a while.

Perhaps they could expand on the Rotweiler class, but I wonder if they want to use the resourses for that with increased numbers of riverclads and the more capable cities class coming off the building slips. There are the Haarahlds, of course. They are going to be a fearsome opponent wherever they show up. But there are going to be too few of them to make a significant dent in the ICN's overall problem.

I find myself wondering if it wouldn't be a good thing to take about 20 of the more recently built galleons, cut them down and make Rotweilers out of them, but adding steam engines in addition to the armor. You could put in the same 30 gun configuration and use smaller steam engines than the Haarahlds. That gets you better blue water coverage and would be an impressive ship even though it doesn't match up to the Haarahds.

It's fortunate that at the moment nobody seems to have any appetite for challenging the ICN at sea. That does give them time for considering and resolving their problem with wooden hulls. On the other hand they are staying out of the Gulf of Dohlar right now because they are not wanting to expose their unarmored hulls to Thirsk's shell armed fleet and his screw galleys. That certainly highlights their vulnerability.

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
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Re: Steel Thistle silk - uses
Post by Randomiser   » Sat Oct 03, 2015 8:20 am

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n7axw wrote:It's fortunate that at the moment nobody seems to have any appetite for challenging the ICN at sea. That does give them time for considering and resolving their problem with wooden hulls. On the other hand they are staying out of the Gulf of Dohlar right now because they are not wanting to expose their unarmored hulls to Thirsk's shell armed fleet and his screw galleys. That certainly highlights their vulnerability.

Don


Well, it's not just good fortune is it? Everyone has the problem of how to cope with their naval foes firing explosive shells at them. The CoGA forces even more than the EoC, given the Charisian numerical, experience and battle-tested equipment superiority. The difference is that the Charisians have the solution on the building slips and they will be arriving 'real soon now'. In the meantime, the EoC have no very pressing reason to go in and deal with Thirsk, so long as he stays home. Their much more pressing problem is convoy defence against fast raiders, and RFC reckons they will have that sorted just fine once they reorganise their shipping practices to deal with the problem. It seems the Harahlds and the 'Cities' have been a long time coming, but they are well in hand and are going to be crushing when they do arrive, so it would be a distraction to divert effort to other solutions which might not, now, get into service all that much quicker anyway.

BTW What is the current textev estimate for the Harahlds getting into service?
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Re: Steel Thistle silk - uses
Post by MTO   » Sat Oct 03, 2015 8:42 pm

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For almost completely unrelated reasons, I was recently reading on Wikipedia about plaster of Paris... So, plaster casts entered medicinal use in the 1800s, based on things noticed by doctors in the late 1700s... I don't think it was the first composite ever used, but certainly an early one. Anyhow, I bring it up because it seems likely that, with their advanced medicine, Safeholdians probably know about the advantages of casts. Going from silk+plaster for casts to silk+plaster for lightweight composite armour is not going to be a big stretch. I'm sure they have better ceramics than plaster, too, but I don't know that silk would handle being fired in a kiln when embedded in clay...

Anyhow, long story short, I think they already have all the pieces to make silk composite armour, they just need to connect the dots.
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Re: Steel Thistle silk - uses
Post by McGuiness   » Sat Oct 03, 2015 9:00 pm

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Randomiser wrote:BTW What is the current textev estimate for the Haarahlds getting into service?
August I believe. Depending on how long of a "working up" cruise they need, the first ones could arrive at Hook Island to begin the assault on the Gulf of Dohlar in October or November.

Maybe we'll finally get the Battle of Gorath Bay!!!! :twisted:

"Oh bother", said Pooh as he glanced through the airlock window at the helmet he'd forgotten to wear.
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Re: Steel Thistle silk - uses
Post by n7axw   » Sun Oct 04, 2015 8:53 am

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Randomiser wrote:
n7axw wrote:It's fortunate that at the moment nobody seems to have any appetite for challenging the ICN at sea. That does give them time for considering and resolving their problem with wooden hulls. On the other hand they are staying out of the Gulf of Dohlar right now because they are not wanting to expose their unarmored hulls to Thirsk's shell armed fleet and his screw galleys. That certainly highlights their vulnerability.

Don


Well, it's not just good fortune is it? Everyone has the problem of how to cope with their naval foes firing explosive shells at them. The CoGA forces even more than the EoC, given the Charisian numerical, experience and battle-tested equipment superiority. The difference is that the Charisians have the solution on the building slips and they will be arriving 'real soon now'. In the meantime, the EoC have no very pressing reason to go in and deal with Thirsk, so long as he stays home. Their much more pressing problem is convoy defence against fast raiders, and RFC reckons they will have that sorted just fine once they reorganise their shipping practices to deal with the problem. It seems the Harahlds and the 'Cities' have been a long time coming, but they are well in hand and are going to be crushing when they do arrive, so it would be a distraction to divert effort to other solutions which might not, now, get into service all that much quicker anyway.

BTW What is the current textev estimate for the Harahlds getting into service?


In yerms of the timeline of the book it really hasn't been all that long of a wait for the Haarahlds... it just seems that way to us because getting at the book itself has been taking an eternity... :lol:

End of June...At least that's what Housmyn told Ahlvyno, iirc. My concern with the Haarahlds is not with how long they are taking, but with how few of them there are in light of the ICN's responsibilities. Think of the job the Royal Navy had when the sun never set on the British Empire.

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
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Re: Steel Thistle silk - uses
Post by Randomiser   » Sun Oct 04, 2015 10:06 am

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n7axw wrote:In yerms of the timeline of the book it really hasn't been all that long of a wait for the Haarahlds... it just seems that way to us because getting at the book itself has been taking an eternity... :lol:

End of June...At least that's what Housmyn told Ahlvyno, iirc. My concern with the Haarahlds is not with how long they are taking, but with how few of them there are in light of the ICN's responsibilities. Think of the job the Royal Navy had when the sun never set on the British Empire.

Don


Well, yes Don, but back then we had the Germans, the French, The Japanese, you Yanks and even the Russians to worry about. Who do the Charisans have to worry about on a short to medium timescale as regards a line of battle fleet? Only Thirsk - and his fleet is going to be pounded.

I take it that is the Haralds begin launching in June and not are available on station then, so it will be a while longer before we see the Dohlaran fleet get invited to surrender.
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Re: Steel Thistle silk - uses
Post by shaeun   » Sun Oct 04, 2015 10:23 am

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Randomiser wrote:
n7axw wrote:In yerms of the timeline of the book it really hasn't been all that long of a wait for the Haarahlds... it just seems that way to us because getting at the book itself has been taking an eternity... :lol:

End of June...At least that's what Housmyn told Ahlvyno, iirc. My concern with the Haarahlds is not with how long they are taking, but with how few of them there are in light of the ICN's responsibilities. Think of the job the Royal Navy had when the sun never set on the British Empire.

Don


Well, yes Don, but back then we had the Germans, the French, The Japanese, you Yanks and even the Russians to worry about. Who do the Charisans have to worry about on a short to medium timescale as regards a line of battle fleet? Only Thirsk - and his fleet is going to be pounded.

I take it that is the Haralds begin launching in June and not are available on station then, so it will be a while longer before we see the Dohlaran fleet get invited to surrender.


There needs to be a scene where a creman pains 'Do you Surrender?" on one of the explosive shells before firing it off...
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Re: Steel Thistle silk - uses
Post by n7axw   » Sun Oct 04, 2015 1:36 pm

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Randomiser wrote:
n7axw wrote:In yerms of the timeline of the book it really hasn't been all that long of a wait for the Haarahlds... it just seems that way to us because getting at the book itself has been taking an eternity... :lol:

End of June...At least that's what Housmyn told Ahlvyno, iirc. My concern with the Haarahlds is not with how long they are taking, but with how few of them there are in light of the ICN's responsibilities. Think of the job the Royal Navy had when the sun never set on the British Empire.

Don


Well, yes Don, but back then we had the Germans, the French, The Japanese, you Yanks and even the Russians to worry about. Who do the Charisans have to worry about on a short to medium timescale as regards a line of battle fleet? Only Thirsk - and his fleet is going to be pounded.

I take it that is the Haralds begin launching in June and not are available on station then, so it will be a while longer before we see the Dohlaran fleet get invited to surrender.


Worried about Yanks??? I thought we were buds! During the 19th century we built our nation almost interference free under the protection of the British Navy. I always thought we should have thanked you for that. We didn't even have to pay taxes! :lol:

In a more serious vein, Charis needs to be able to use its fleet to control coast lines as it pursues its land war, both for burning out privateers and transporting and supplying armies. That plus the convoy protection we've already discussed in other threads. It doesn't have any serious challenge at sea at the moment, but even without that it has more job to do than hulls to cover especially with possibility of facing the other side's explosive shells. That's the point I was making.

Don
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Re: Steel Thistle silk - uses
Post by Expert snuggler   » Sun Oct 04, 2015 7:56 pm

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>I don't think it was the first composite ever used, but certainly an early one.

Do bricks made with straw count?

Wood is a composite, which may inspire someone at the College before long.
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Re: Steel Thistle silk - uses
Post by maggiegirl   » Tue Oct 06, 2015 7:39 pm

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Now that the steel Thistle silk gin has been perfected, the spinning mills are turning out lovely, top quality and affordable KNITTING yarns and we women are busily knitting our fighting men stockings that will hold up to the long months they are away campaigning. As you know, we humans have been knitting stockings to support our military for a very long time...and of course, the tradition still goes on with this very long, drawn out war, and with so many men marching it is very hard on their feet. The best care packages have fresh supplies of those wonderful hand knit stockings now days.
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