HFQ Official Snippet #19 (I think)

JeffEngel wrote:

EdThomas wrote:Don,
You're right about the number of cavalry. I went back to the MHOG chapter in LAMA and did some arithmetic.
“almost seventy percent of the regular army was still mounted. The reformers had, however, built up a solid core of over one hundred thousand well-trained, well-armed, well-armored heavy infantry, supported by thirty thousand bowmen and arbalesteers and a tiny handful of matchlock-armed musketeers. The IHA’s true striking power, however , continued to reside in the highly mobile horse archers who composed nearly half its total manpower.”

“the entire Imperial Harchongese Army had numbered less than five hundred thousand men, horse and foot, with no field artillery at all, at the beginning of the Schism.”

They’d gone from a strength of four hundred seventy-one thousand to one of over one million and three hundred thousand in less than four months,

Weber, David (2014-02-18). Like a Mighty Army (Safehold) (p. 493). Tom Doherty Associates. Kindle Edition.

70% x 470,000 = 329,000 mounted
45% x 470,000 = 211,500 horse archers
117,500 other mounted troops
829,000 conscripts
The 100,000 trained pikemen is interesting. This would be an excellent source for junior officers and ncos for the conscript units. MHOG might not be as bad as we've been thinking.

Those horse archers are intriguing. Given that they would be very well trained and experienced, they'd be able to move overland at fair speed and harass Charisian/Siddarmark formations (or supply columns) at range. A very good horse archer is only barely getting superceded by the current rifles in wide service.

Whether or not those troops would be willing to do good cavalry service that way is another issue, alas.

Given what the AoG advisers can communicate, I think dispersed formations among the rifle-equipped infantry really may be the order of the day. Even though the Host will be strapped for confident, knowledgeable and experienced NCO's and junior officers to lead those groups, artillery and rifle fire leave them no good choice. (And higher up, they have to worry about senile commanders.) Packing men up to keep them under great central control while they die by the hundreds is not better than spreading them out under the control of non-coms working out what they are doing by theory and on-the-job. Neither is entirely palatable, of course, and the second goes against tradition, but at least it allows those non-coms and junior officers maybe to live and have their troops live long enough to shoot back and learn better.

While Clyntahn adores Harchong's orthodoxy, I doubt he's committed to geriatric command and may not get in the way of any maneuvers Duchairn and Magwair may sponsor to make sure that the very old, very senior, very hidebound officers are kept in places where they are either junior to an experienced AoG officer and/or having the actual work done by someone younger and more professional. Just how far they can go with that sort of shuffling is an open question. Some terribly senior sorts may have to get themselves and a lot of their men killed in old-fashioned charges to clear the command structure up top.

The mounted troops that aren't horse archers - classic heavy cavalry, I assume? - are not likely to do much good. Hopefully they can be re-trained as dragoons, or at least broken up into special purpose forces on strange occasions where a cavalry charge again has a point. But they're also, happily, a small portion of the new, triple-size Harchongese army.

n7axw wrote:

JeffEngel" quote="EdThomas wrote:Don,
You're right about the number of cavalry. I went back to the MHOG chapter in LAMA and did some arithmetic.
“almost seventy percent of the regular army was still mounted. The reformers had, however, built up a solid core of over one hundred thousand well-trained, well-armed, well-armored heavy infantry, supported by thirty thousand bowmen and arbalesteers and a tiny handful of matchlock-armed musketeers. The IHA’s true striking power, however , continued to reside in the highly mobile horse archers who composed nearly half its total manpower.”

“the entire Imperial Harchongese Army had numbered less than five hundred thousand men, horse and foot, with no field artillery at all, at the beginning of the Schism.”

They’d gone from a strength of four hundred seventy-one thousand to one of over one million and three hundred thousand in less than four months,

Weber, David (2014-02-18). Like a Mighty Army (Safehold) (p. 493). Tom Doherty Associates. Kindle Edition.

70% x 470,000 = 329,000 mounted
45% x 470,000 = 211,500 horse archers
117,500 other mounted troops
829,000 conscripts
The 100,000 trained pikemen is interesting. This would be an excellent source for junior officers and ncos for the conscript units. MHOG might not be as bad as we've been thinking.

Those horse archers are intriguing. Given that they would be very well trained and experienced, they'd be able to move overland at fair speed and harass Charisian/Siddarmark formations (or supply columns) at range. A very good horse archer is only barely getting superceded by the current rifles in wide service.

Whether or not those troops would be willing to do good cavalry service that way is another issue, alas.

Given what the AoG advisers can communicate, I think dispersed formations among the rifle-equipped infantry really may be the order of the day. Even though the Host will be strapped for confident, knowledgeable and experienced NCO's and junior officers to lead those groups, artillery and rifle fire leave them no good choice. (And higher up, they have to worry about senile commanders.) Packing men up to keep them under great central control while they die by the hundreds is not better than spreading them out under the control of non-coms working out what they are doing by theory and on-the-job. Neither is entirely palatable, of course, and the second goes against tradition, but at least it allows those non-coms and junior officers maybe to live and have their troops live long enough to shoot back and learn better.

While Clyntahn adores Harchong's orthodoxy, I doubt he's committed to geriatric command and may not get in the way of any maneuvers Duchairn and Magwair may sponsor to make sure that the very old, very senior, very hidebound officers are kept in places where they are either junior to an experienced AoG officer and/or having the actual work done by someone younger and more professional. Just how far they can go with that sort of shuffling is an open question. Some terribly senior sorts may have to get themselves and a lot of their men killed in old-fashioned charges to clear the command structure up top.

The mounted troops that aren't horse archers - classic heavy cavalry, I assume? - are not likely to do much good. Hopefully they can be re-trained as dragoons, or at least broken up into special purpose forces on strange occasions where a cavalry charge again has a point. But they're also, happily, a small portion of the new, triple-size Harchongese army.

saber964 wrote:
Well how about Duke Sun Rising's official rank which IIRC is Admiral of the Broad Ocean's. And we've also seen other silly rank titles like Lord of Spears and Captain of the Winds

n7axw wrote:I wonder if Captain of the Winds is Captain of a trade wind, a hurricane or a tornado... Do you think there's a way to research that? Hummm

Don

n7axw wrote:

Weird Harold wrote:Actually, I believe the Mighty Host will move along canals, but only their supplies will move on the canals.

You guys might be right. However as I hear what's being said, that lack of availability has to do more with the disruption of existing arrangements than it does the lack of possibility of doing it a different way. Then too, if the canals go where you need to go, obviously you use the canal. In my previous post I noted that two of the three armies I was visualizing would be using the canals. There might not even be a road where they need to go.

Weird Harold wrote:

n7axw wrote:I wonder if Captain of the Winds is Captain of a trade wind, a hurricane or a tornado... Do you think there's a way to research that? Hummm

Don

At a guess, I'd say "Captain of the Arrow Storm" would be close to the right "wind."

saber964 wrote:
Actually the first time I read the term it made me laugh because "winds" is an old fashioned term for passing gas or breaking wind. So we have a title of Captain of the Farts.

n7axw wrote:I did a bit of research on this and concluded that Lyonheart is probably right. Armies have building bridges since antiquity in our timeline. There is no reason to believe that is not also true for Safehold. Ahlverez probably has engineers with ability to do that, maybe pontoon bridges rather than rafts lashed together.

Wouldn't it be a hoot if Ahlverez got his bridge built and Delthak shows up to crash the party during the crossing?

Don

Bahrns nodded, although if truth be told he was a long way from guessing where this was headed. Did the emperor intend to send Delthak and Hador up to relieve Saygin and Tellesberg? “I have something a bit different in mind for you and Captain Tailahr, however,” the emperor said, as if he’d read Bahrns’ mind, and rumor suggested he might very well be able to do exactly that.

“You do, Your Majesty?” the captain asked when Cayleb paused , and the emperor nodded. “I do, indeed, Captain . Fortunately, all the pieces for the operation I have in mind won’t be available for some five-days yet, so you should have ample time to complete your repairs and maintenance. And I think you’ll find it just a bit warmer than Spinefish Bay would be, too. Probably in more than one way.”

“Anyway, we’re in decent shape where they’re concerned, but production of the new guns is running ahead of schedule. We already had quite a few gun tubes; now mount production’s catching up, and the weapons for the improved River-class ships will be ready well before the ships themselves are. Half the new hulls are already afloat or ready for launch, but it’s going to be at least a month before the first one commissions, and I already have enough of the new guns to arm the first flight of the new ships and replace the thirty -pounders aboard the original ironclads. I’d really like to go ahead and send the extras off to Siddarmark in the next convoy.”
“Domynyk?” Pine Hollow looked at the high admiral.
“Suits me.” Rock Point snorted. “Worst case, the last half dozen of the improved Rivers are delayed a month or two waiting for their guns and we get the four originals into service instead. And Shan-wei knows they aren’t doing anyone any good sitting in an ordnance warehouse here in Old Charis!”

n7axw wrote:Yeah, I remember what you said about going to Evyrtyn. If you can see a way of getting Ahlverez there without being interdicted by Hanth, I will agree with you. But I don't think you can.

Don