Tanks on Safehold

Loren Pechtel wrote:Would tanks have a role as raiders?

I would envision something rather different than "tanks" or even armored cars (Praiger-driven of course) as raiders.

In this thread, we keep thinking "bigger and more massive..." Let's turn it down a couple notches and go to the other end of the spectrum in the raider / scouting department: Motorcycles.

We've already seen textev that talks about the possible range for a Praiger-driven vehicle (IIRC 25 gallons of fuel and 25 gallons of water for some preposterous range).

But think of a heavy-duty, motorcycle with maybe 10 gallons of water and fuel? Able to travel perhaps several hundred miles? Perhaps a platoon of scouts mounted on these? able to travel on the high roads as well as offroad (at least in moderately dry conditions with "fat boy" tires (we've seen textev about pneumatic tires being developed for bicycle use).

High torque, perhaps a max of 30 MPH. VERY quiet (little engine noise). Hmmm. The possibilities are endless. Much faster than horse-based scouting, able to go almost everywhere a horse could go. Able to evade almost any opposing forces.

WeberFan wrote:

Loren Pechtel wrote:Would tanks have a role as raiders?

I would envision something rather different than "tanks" or even armored cars (Praiger-driven of course) as raiders.

In this thread, we keep thinking "bigger and more massive..." Let's turn it down a couple notches and go to the other end of the spectrum in the raider / scouting department: Motorcycles.

We've already seen textev that talks about the possible range for a Praiger-driven vehicle (IIRC 25 gallons of fuel and 25 gallons of water for some preposterous range).

But think of a heavy-duty, motorcycle with maybe 10 gallons of water and fuel? Able to travel perhaps several hundred miles? Perhaps a platoon of scouts mounted on these? able to travel on the high roads as well as offroad (at least in moderately dry conditions with "fat boy" tires (we've seen textev about pneumatic tires being developed for bicycle use).

High torque, perhaps a max of 30 MPH. VERY quiet (little engine noise). Hmmm. The possibilities are endless. Much faster than horse-based scouting, able to go almost everywhere a horse could go. Able to evade almost any opposing forces.

Jay Leno has a steam car that he showed off one time to a car enthusiast tv program. That car was quiet and fast. In comparison to Horses easier to feed. Run out of coal, switch to what ever you can get your hands on that burns. If you run out of fuel for a few days, not a problem, run out of food and water for a horse it is dead.

Motorcycle easier to transport across the oceans and cleaner too. First biker gang Shanwei's Angles. Merlin gets to wear leather

Shortly after Safehold got the bicycle, there's a comment about them having potential use for military scouting. We don't see any bicycle scouts after that, but the idea's there -- we just need someone to come up with mounting a Praiger on a heavy bike frame.

Julia Minor wrote:Shortly after Safehold got the bicycle, there's a comment about them having potential use for military scouting. We don't see any bicycle scouts after that, but the idea's there -- we just need someone to come up with mounting a Praiger on a heavy bike frame.

If you're going for a wheeled vehicle I would be more inclined towards something like a dune buggy.

Loren Pechtel wrote:

Julia Minor wrote:Shortly after Safehold got the bicycle, there's a comment about them having potential use for military scouting. We don't see any bicycle scouts after that, but the idea's there -- we just need someone to come up with mounting a Praiger on a heavy bike frame.

If you're going for a wheeled vehicle I would be more inclined towards something like a dune buggy.

For terraformed/farmed areas a jeep equivalent is the best scout as it can carry a MG. For wilderness/non terraformed areas I would keep the mk1 horse and rider as the transport option of choice as they handle wilderness much better than machines..

Motorcycle or jeep (or combined) scouting units are likely. You could configure a squad with 9 motorcycle troops and one command jeep (with machine gun). A platoon would have four such squads, and an additional 5 motorcycles and command jeep.

Also, I don't see why Charis couldn't build self-propelled artillery or mechanized infantry. Even without building full up tanks, Charis could build infantry carriers that at the very least transported a platoon up to the battle lines before dropping them off and falling back. This would drastically increase the mobility of infantry in any kind of movement warfare (or just getting where they need to go). Likewise, Charis could build steam-powered 'cabs' that towed artillery pieces at higher speeds (and for longer) than either horses or dragons could. Similarly, Charis could build re-fueling vehicles that just carried barrel drums of oil and/or water.

Unless and until the Siddarmark-Charis Cold War goes hot, I don't see a war breaking out that would encourage the development of tanks. Steam- or deisel-powered jeeps, artillery tractors, and armored cars, yes. Land ironclads, no.

Charis isn't going to invade South Harchong and the ICN will be able to keep anything beyond small arms being sent into North Harchong, so the Harchong Civil War won't lead to the development of tanks.

Tanks aren't needed as technology demonstrators. Everything they could demonstrate can and will be demonstrated by other means that are more useful to Charis. If tanks are built, it's probable that either Siddarmark or Desnair builds the first to become public knowledge and will be similar to either the British Mark I, the French CA1, or the German A7V from the Great War. Charis's first tank would likely be similar to the Renault FT and be built and deployed only once some mainland power starts tank development on their own.