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Guns, Guns Guns

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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by biochem   » Wed Jan 16, 2013 8:53 pm

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Given that Obama just enacted it by executive order instead of by law, I predict left leaning judges will uphold it, conservative judges will rule it unconstitutional and the whole mess will wind up at the supreme court.
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by JimHacker   » Thu Jan 17, 2013 8:12 am

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biochem wrote:Given that Obama just enacted it by executive order instead of by law, I predict left leaning judges will uphold it, conservative judges will rule it unconstitutional and the whole mess will wind up at the supreme court.


I thought he was just implementing the stuff he had the powers to do so by executive order and leaving the rest to congress?
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by Daryl   » Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:24 pm

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I'd like to remark that the NRA ad using the President's kids is contemptible. An unfortunate aspect of being in such a powerful and prominent position is that both you and those around you are in increased danger of being targeted by nutters (particularly in a society awash with guns). Armed guards are no guarantee of safety as they don't provide a material shield. An old adage is that if the enemy is in range then so are you.
Regardless of the armed guards the President's daughters are less safe than most kids in western societies. This ad perpetuates the myth that having guns makes you safe.
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by biochem   » Thu Jan 17, 2013 8:39 pm

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I thought he was just implementing the stuff he had the powers to do so by executive order and leaving the rest to congress?


That depends on which lawyer you believe. The legal analysts for the conservative outlets say it's unconstitutional, the legal analysts for the liberal ones say it's not. The courts will need to sort it out.
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by Eyal   » Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:50 pm

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JimHacker wrote:The problem with that sort of plan would be that there would be ways for disreputable people to easily (but illegally) run a background check on someone without their knowledge or consent if they pretended they needed it so they could sell that person a weapon.


What about doing it the other way around? Make it the buyer's responsibility to get a background check.

For example:

You could get a document stating that you have passed a requisite background check to buy a firearm either from the police or from a business or organization licensed to issue it. The seller must require you present said document (which is good for only one month) before making a sale. In order to prevent forgeries, each such certificate possesses a unique identifying number and is stroed ina central database (which contains only the number and the issue date). The seller must contact the database and supply the certificate number, to verify it was indeed issued on the date listed (you could do this with a website or automated phone message). The seller is required to keep a copy of the certificate for his records.

Now this proposal is based on the assumption you want minimum details stored, to avoid possible creation of a registry. If you're willing to relax this requirement a bit, you could make the system more secure by including the name of the person receiving the certificate in the database, so the seller can verify that the person who received certificate X is indeed the buyer. You could have the record automatically purged after a month, when the certificate expires.
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by Eyal   » Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:53 pm

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Daryl wrote:I'd like to remark that the NRA ad using the President's kids is contemptible. An unfortunate aspect of being in such a powerful and prominent position is that both you and those around you are in increased danger of being targeted by nutters (particularly in a society awash with guns). Armed guards are no guarantee of safety as they don't provide a material shield. An old adage is that if the enemy is in range then so are you.
Regardless of the armed guards the President's daughters are less safe than most kids in western societies. This ad perpetuates the myth that having guns makes you safe.


There's also the issue that the well-being of the President's family is arguably a secondary objective of their security. It's also necessary because should the President's child be kidnapped, he could be very effectively pressured to change policy.
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by pokermind   » Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:00 pm

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Eyal, delete you suggestion quick before Al Gore sees it and thinks money maker!

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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by Eyal   » Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:52 am

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pokermind wrote:Eyal, delete you suggestion quick before Al Gore sees it and thinks money maker!

Poker


I'm afraid I don't get it. Why Gore specifically?
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by Daryl   » Sun Jan 20, 2013 6:26 am

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As a non US Republican, Eyal I don't quite get it either. I do agree that Gore is somewhat of a hypocrite jetting all over the world spreading CO2 to warn about the problem of man made CO2, but he does have a point. Even the most rabid climate change deniers are one by one quietly backtracking as the evidence mounts up. To those saying that mankind's activities can't change the climate I point out that the north of Africa had good rainfall until the felling of the cedar forests in Lebanon in 1000BC to AD for making triremes for their wars (Troy etc) changed the weather patterns, or how the central Australian deserts were rain forests until about 50,000BC when the first humans brought fire stick hunting to the continent.
I do wonder what the world would have been like if Bush hadn't managed to fiddle the election away from Gore. Gore has about twice the IQ but less rat cunning or political skills that GW had. I think that Afghanistan would sill have been flattened but IRAQ would have been left alone. Back to topic now - sorry about that.

Eyal wrote:
pokermind wrote:Eyal, delete you suggestion quick before Al Gore sees it and thinks money maker!

Poker


I'm afraid I don't get it. Why Gore specifically?
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by pokermind   » Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:18 pm

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Eyal wrote:
pokermind wrote:Eyal, delete you suggestion quick before Al Gore sees it and thinks money maker!

Poker


I'm afraid I don't get it. Why Gore specifically?


He was poised to make millions in carbon credit trading while strangling business is why. putting our second amendment rights in the hands of such an opportunist is a guarantee of price gouging, just saying.

Poker
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"Better to be hung for a hexapuma than a housecat," Com. Pang Yau-pau, ART.
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