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Ebola Virus

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Re: Ebola Virus
Post by cthia   » Mon Aug 04, 2014 6:12 pm

cthia
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Phuck!

Namelessfly, thanks for this post. I was wrong. No, I was very wrong not to worry about the border. Actually, I didn't think the border would come into play until well after the virus spread to other countries. Obviously that is wrong. I did worry about terrorist opportunists, who might utilize the border as an easy entry point, but I didn't want to bring that up, possibly giving would be terrorists ideas.

My main concern was making this out of a political matter, at this time. Now is the time to come together as a nation and not fight amongst ourselves; therefore I didn't want to turn this post into an avenue for political grandstanding. Perhaps that is unrealistic, but I do not want to lose sight of what's at stake.

You have my apology again for not taking your concern more seriously. I never formally posted dissention because it is obvious that the border is a weak point. I assumed the U.S. would fortify the border as required, at the proper time, as per this outbreak warrants. Seems, as you have suggested, that proper time has past.

Thanks again for this post AND enlightenment. It is what this thread was created for.

Nice work. Very nice work. Though frightening!

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Ebola Virus
Post by namelessfly   » Mon Aug 04, 2014 7:35 pm

namelessfly

Actually; it appears that we might already have the first US patient who is some wealthy, white asshole (excuse me "person") who had visited Africa during a plague just for shits and giggles. While it is less probable that this potential plague vector exposed fewer people than would be exposed in one of Obama's illegal immigration enabling centers, it still scares the crap out of me.

The point is that the US should be exceptionally vigilante about controlling it's borders right now. IMHO, we should quarenteen EVERYONE who has been to Africa even if they are US citizens whom had all proper visas. The flood of illegals should never have been allowed. By this time, the only way we could stop it is by stationing snipers armed with .50 BMB on hilltops about one mile apart. I know it sucks, but that is our reality.

May be we will have to seal off New York City as in BATMAN RISING only it will be the US government rather than the terrorists nuking the place?

Sorry I come across as so hostile rather than merely jaded and acerbic, but I definitely believe that people should suffer the consequences of their stupidity. Just think of it as an example of evolution in action? IMHO, electing then reelecting Obama was such a profoundly stupid thing for the US electorate to do that one can argue that we would be getting off easy if all we suffer is a plague that kills only a few million people. Given the fact that people in NYC voted overwhelmingly for Obama, it would be a bit of poetic justice if that city got reamed.

cthia wrote:

Phuck!

Namelessfly, thanks for this post. I was wrong. No, I was very wrong not to worry about the border. Actually, I didn't think the border would come into play until well after the virus spread to other countries. Obviously that is wrong. I did worry about terrorist opportunists, who might utilize the border as an easy entry point, but I didn't want to bring that up, possibly giving would be terrorists ideas.

My main concern was making this out of a political matter, at this time. Now is the time to come together as a nation and not fight amongst ourselves; therefore I didn't want to turn this post into an avenue for political grandstanding. Perhaps that is unrealistic, but I do not want to lose sight of what's at stake.

You have my apology again for not taking your concern more seriously. I never formally posted dissention because it is obvious that the border is a weak point. I assumed the U.S. would fortify the border as required, at the proper time, as per this outbreak warrants. Seems, as you have suggested, that proper time has past.

Thanks again for this post AND enlightenment. It is what this thread was created for.

Nice work. Very nice work. Though frightening!
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Re: Ebola Virus
Post by PeterZ   » Mon Aug 04, 2014 9:01 pm

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C'mon 'Fly! The NYC infection did not result from any Obama policy. The idiot tourist did it himself/herself. If another infection vector is discovered from illegals crossing the border, I hope that vector hits the open border crowd primarily. There would be some justice there. Not wishing it happens at all. If it does, however, impacting the open borders crowd disproportionately would be justice.
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Re: Ebola Virus
Post by Daryl   » Mon Aug 04, 2014 9:04 pm

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Shakespeare wrote Much Ado about Nothing centuries ago. Before we station snipers on rooftops with 50 cal weapons to shoot people a mile away we need to understand that Ebola poses no risk to a modern society. If a germ warfare lab managed to make it air transmissible and able to survive exposure to sunlight then just possibly it could be a problem. Not quite sure what the heavy sniper rifles would be for, as it's somewhat difficult to diagnose illness at a mile range?
It is a bit sad that no matter what the issue, somehow it's Obama's fault. That obsession is what is actually unhealthy here.
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Re: Ebola Virus
Post by Arol   » Mon Aug 04, 2014 9:16 pm

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Daryl wrote: ...It is a bit sad that no matter what the issue, somehow it's Obama's fault. That obsession is what is actually unhealthy here.

It's always nice with a scapegoat!
I think that if we were told that the sun would go nova in 24 hours, some people would find a way to blame Obama!
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Re: Ebola Virus
Post by namelessfly   » Mon Aug 04, 2014 10:35 pm

namelessfly

PeterZ wrote:C'mon 'Fly! The NYC infection did not result from any Obama policy. The idiot tourist did it himself/herself. If another infection vector is discovered from illegals crossing the border, I hope that vector hits the open border crowd primarily. There would be some justice there. Not wishing it happens at all. If it does, however, impacting the open borders crowd disproportionately would be justice.



Granted that the idiot tourists is an idiot.

However; the US State Dept has authority to ban travel to countries. (example, it was illegal for US citizens to travel to Pakistan back when Obama attended a Madrasa in Pakistan, LOL.). This authority is intended to protect the US from idiots. The US DoS should have banned travel except for government and aid workers early in the epidemic.

Right now there is no credible confirmation that the tourist has Ebola.

Keep in mind that if Ebola is brought into the US by illegal immigrants crossing the unprotected Southern border, the community most immediately effected will be the Mexican-American, Central American (Citizen, Legal Alien, and Illegal Alien alike), and other ethnic groups that are immigrating illegally. The African American community which lives in closer proximity to illegal immigrant groups will also be at greater risk of exposure than Caucasian Americans. Unless there is a genetic component that affects fatality rates, this virus could ensure Republican victories for decades!
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Re: Ebola Virus
Post by Thucydides   » Tue Aug 05, 2014 12:21 am

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Ebola is very frightening because of the things it does to the body of the infected, destroying cell walls and allowing blood and fluids to leak out in an uncontrollable manner.

Ebola is not as frightening as other possibilities, however.

Soviet Russia had a totally irresponsible and illegal organization called Biopreparat which manufactured tonnes of such disease organisms as Smallpox, Anthrax and various other plagues, as well as means to deliver them (including refrigerated ICBM reentry vehicles). Since the collapse of the USSR, there has been little understanding of what happened to these stockpiles or many of the scientists and technicians who made this possible. One can only hope the various agents have degraded over time.

Some time ago, scientists revived the flu virus responsible for the 1918 "Spanish Flu", which went global and killed @ 20 million people. Other scientists apparently discovered a way of combing the worst features of swine and avian flu, and were apparently going to publish their paper, before the US government "requested" it be pulled.

And of course the truly dedicated could try going to old test ranges and digging in soil in the hope of finding spores of other militarized diseases. The Anthrax attacks on the US capital after 9/11 seem to have been pulled off by one individual, or at most a very tiny conspiracy with access to a militarized version of Anthrax.

And nature has an entire reservoir of other diseases that are still out there like the Black plague and hemorrhagic fever, which could enter heavily populated cities and simply overwhelm the existing medical services.

Our best defence is to:

a. keep ourselves healthy with diet and exercise, so disease is less likely to get us
b. take sensible precautions, including some stocking of food and water in case services break down temporarily
c. Ensure that the health care infrastructure is sound, through whatever means possible (this might depend a lot on your particular location and circumstances)

This is why any plague that gets a foothold in a third world city will be so devastating there, they simply don't have the resources and a huge fraction of the population is unhealthy already. In the first world, things will get bad, but probably not unmanageable, unless it is a genetically engineered super disease like "Captain Trips" from Steven King's "The Stand".
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Re: Ebola Virus
Post by Dieu_Le_Fera   » Tue Aug 05, 2014 11:47 am

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namelessfly wrote: stuff


They don't ban travel they give advisory warnings *that should be heeded none the less*. Citizens of the United States have been going to Cuba, Iran and North Korea very frequently, even though the state department warns against it. Most just go to say they did... it is actually pretty easy to get a tourist Visa to those places... If you want a reminder you can ask those tourist hikers in Iraq who crossed the boarder into Iran...
"Battle Cruisers lead the way!"
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Re: Ebola Virus
Post by cthia   » Tue Aug 05, 2014 2:01 pm

cthia
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Thucydides wrote:Ebola is very frightening because of the things it does to the body of the infected, destroying cell walls and allowing blood and fluids to leak out in an uncontrollable manner.

-snip-

Do note that these are just the beginnings of the virus' inexorable march to its goal of turning the entire body into itself — one big gooey pile of extremely hot ebola.

After achieving that goal, the intestines opens up and sprays, looking for something other to infect. The virus' goal isn't to kill. It is to live.

All, really should read THE HOT ZONE.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Ebola Virus
Post by Northstar   » Tue Aug 05, 2014 2:19 pm

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Daryl wrote:Shakespeare wrote Much Ado about Nothing centuries ago. Before we station snipers on rooftops with 50 cal weapons to shoot people a mile away we need to understand that Ebola poses no risk to a modern society. If a germ warfare lab managed to make it air transmissible and able to survive exposure to sunlight then just possibly it could be a problem. Not quite sure what the heavy sniper rifles would be for, as it's somewhat difficult to diagnose illness at a mile range?
It is a bit sad that no matter what the issue, somehow it's Obama's fault. That obsession is what is actually unhealthy here.


Bioaparat's demons are indeed scary. Back in my streak of reading books about all this one was by Ken Alabek... spelling his name wrong ... formerly of Bioaparat and an American germ warfare guy trading remarks about things drifting on the wind.. creepiest conversation I ever read.

Let us all hope all those evil genies stay in their bottles, ok?

Whomever it was who pointed out Ebola Reston had gone airborne was correct. Not only airborne but escaped. I entertained the jolly notion it has maybe swept the world vaccinating many against Ebola as cowpox vaccinated against smallpox. Cheery thought eh? Ebola Reston was lethal to monkeys but not much worse than a cold to humans.

The worry is the way viruses can trade info with each other. Like, say, Ebola and the common cold. Not good. Hopefully does not happen.

Am I running around in a panic about Ebola? No. No point to that. Am I stocked up? Yes, but I have been for over forty years as far as I'm gonna so no worries there either. Not because I cannot think up awful scenarios in which we Northstars are screwed but because there is no point. We've done what we reasonably and realistically can, including being on good terms with the neighbors. Beyond that it's in God's hands. If we die, we die. eh.

The chances of surviving in a hospital in an Ebola pandemic that goes wildfire are... nil. At home. Maybe we die, maybe we live. I'd rather do it at home than in a hospital nightmare, thanks.

My advice, for what it's worth, is stay aware but keep your BS detector on. Be stocked up to handle various woe and trouble, whatever feels reasonable and doable to you in your situation. Keep the car gassed up. When out and about park with an eye to getting out in the event something nasty goes down there. That means park by the exit rather than as close to the store or mall or restaurant or whatever as possible. Hey, so you get a bit of walking exercise. :D Likewise, be aware in shops or restaurants or whatever. Where are the exits? How easily can you get to one? Stay where you can see what is going on and where you can get the bleep out pronto if needed. Won't hurt you any. But getting trapped in some crowd panic... not good. Have bug out stuff in your car, just in case. A backpack with some food, water, clothes, to walk home or whatever if ever needed. Hopefully never to be needed. Practice situational awareness and listen to your own intuition. It is your survival sense. Respect it.

Think about what you'd wish you had done if the SHTF of one sort or another. Do it, whatever your personal list is. Then relax. There is no point stressing beyond what is reasonably practical, in your opinion.

Florence Nightingale's Notes on Nursing is very good, buy it. Also Red Cross home nursing manuals, the ones written in the 1950s, preferably. Buy it used. They are more self reliant and practical than new ones. Really. Something on cooking for invalids. :D These are useful whenever somebody gets ill with something or other. Does not need to be something awful. But they did get a work out when I was caring for various ill people over the decades.

Like the Boy Scouts, I guess I believe in being prepared. Doesn't hurt, sometimes helps... a lot.

Keep safe, people. :)
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