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Linux vs Winblows

For anyone who might want to have a side conversation...you're welcome here!
Re: Linux vs Winblows
Post by Imaginos1892   » Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:38 pm

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Uroboros wrote:Why don't I use Linux?

I can't be bothered. I'm bothered enough trying to figure out where everything is on Windows. I just don't care enough to switch, despite potentially being a better program. It's just not better enough for me to care, and I got it free with the computer.

So why change?

Your problems stem from the fact that win-blows goes to great lengths to hide things from you and make it hard to figure out where the Hell it put them. I deal with this every day at work. Then I go home, fire up Linux, and read the Weber Forums.

Linux, like Unix, puts all your user data in your home directory unless you specifically tell it to put it somewhere else. If you need to back it up, or copy it to another computer, it's all in one place and YOU KNOW WHERE. Win-blows stashes stuff in about a dozen different places, some of which are hard for you to access even after you find them. It does this in order to control you, and force you to use THEIR TOOLS to find where it put YOUR DATA. Every version of Unix and Linux I have ever used has put my data in the same place.

Yes, despite being the most wretchedly abominable excuse for an OS any computer user has ever had to suffer with, win-blows is, unfortunately, everywhere. This is because back in 1982 Billzebub sold IBM an OS that did not exist, used the money to take control of a small software company that had illegally hacked a copy of CP/M-86 for use as an engineering tool, and delivered that abortion to IBM as PC-DOS 1.0. IBM then imposed it on the world.

Most companies spend considerable time and money improving their products so people will want to buy them. MicroShaft takes it for granted that nobody would ever WANT to buy their shitty products, and puts all that effort into preventing people from not buying them. They deliberately make every version of their crap incompatible with every other version, forcing you to "upgrade" in order to continue accessing YOUR OWN DATA. Buying a new computer? None of your old MicroShaft software will run on the new version of win-blows, and your data is locked up in their proprietary formats that can only be used by their programs. You're on the Upgrade Treadmill From Hell.

Donna, you mentioned Sun computers. Do you know what OS they run? It's called Solaris, and it's derived from Unix System V Release 4. So, in an attempt to prove cthia wrong, you have done the opposite.
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Re: Linux vs Winblows
Post by Uroboros   » Wed Feb 26, 2014 2:34 am

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Imaginos1892 wrote:(Long post I'm replying to.)


Oh, where to start on this.

First, The burden of proof is on you to make your point. You have failed utterly to make a point, instead relying on name-calling and poor argument. Weather or not Windows is bad is not the issue. The issue is weather Linux is better, and why should anyone change. Instead of addressing this in a logical, mature manner, you have just resorted to name-calling and blaming your competitor product, the lowest and easiest form of argumentation.

Instead of addressing the possible reasons why a person might wish to switch, you immedately begin with name-calling, within the first sentence. This completely and immediately undermines your credibility with the audience. Instead of making a logical, and reasoned argument why Linux is better over Windows, and possibly very good reasons to switch, you launch into a tirade about how bad Windows is.

Why should a consumer, any consumer, who has comfortably used Windows for years, suddenly decide to switch? Where is the reasoned arguments? Where is the proof? Where is the sources? Side-by-side comparisons? Demos? Anything? Did you provide anything like this? No? Just calling it Winblows is good enough to get your point across, I guess.

Second, by insulting the product a person is using, you are insulting the person using it by proxy. You are questioning their fundamental intelligence by using said product. It makes a person completely want to ignore everything that just came out of your lips. Instead of getting the audience on your side, you've just alienated it. All they hear is "You're stupid, you're an idiot, I'm an asshole, pffffffft pffft ffffffppp."

If you wish to illustrate cogently and maturely why you think Windows is an inferior product and why I might be better served with a substitute, please, go on and try again. Use some examples, some actual facts and documented sources that I can peruse. If all you can manage is rhetoric and name-calling, just don't bother. I'll only hear you pucker up again and fart out some more nonsense.

Because, frankly, you've already pissed me off, your potential convert. I put that up as a challenge to convince me, and you have most definitely have not.
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Re: Linux vs Winblows
Post by Eyal   » Wed Feb 26, 2014 7:06 am

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Why? Windows versions don't delete themselves as soon as a new version comes out (hell, my workplace is still doing fine running XP), and system support typically continues for years as well.

mark wrote:Maybe because everytime microsoft makes a new version of windows you'll have to do the same there? And, with linux you can stay up-to-date with everyting else while keeping the same interface for much longer (generally, 10+ years). Changing it every year or so can still be done, but that will only be interface, so won't affect device drivers, or availability of specific applications you like at all.
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Re: Linux vs Winblows
Post by thinkstoomuch   » Wed Feb 26, 2014 8:54 am

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Eyal wrote:Why? Windows versions don't delete themselves as soon as a new version comes out (hell, my workplace is still doing fine running XP), and system support typically continues for years as well.


Yep I am still using XP. Seems like I have been using it for about 12 years now. Kicking and screaming (I want 3.11 back ... not really but ...)

Does everything I want to do. But I need to use something else because ...

Have fun,
T2M
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A: “No. That’s just the price. ...
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Re: Linux vs Winblows
Post by Donnachaidh   » Wed Feb 26, 2014 1:59 pm

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If you'd actually read what I said you'd have noticed that I was using the Sun system as an example of how long systems can be used, I was not using it as an argument either way on Windows vs Linux.

Most people don't feel the need to be bothered to learn a new OS especially when no matter what they do at home they'll be using Windows at work (see my previous posts for why that's unlikely to change).

You're coming across as a fan boy. Fan boy arguments only work when you're preaching to the choir; if someone's not already convinced, they won't work.

Imaginos1892 wrote:[...snipped...]
Donna, you mentioned Sun computers. Do you know what OS they run? It's called Solaris, and it's derived from Unix System V Release 4. So, in an attempt to prove cthia wrong, you have done the opposite.
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Re: Linux vs Winblows
Post by Imaginos1892   » Thu Feb 27, 2014 12:21 am

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Uroboros wrote:(Long rant)

OK, so you're violently opposed to learning something new. Why would that place some sort of burden on ME? You are free to go on wasting time and money on software that is not worth either one. Have fun with the crashes, and the 400,000 viruses.
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Re: Linux vs Winblows
Post by Uroboros   » Thu Feb 27, 2014 1:20 am

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Imaginos1892 wrote:
Uroboros wrote:(Long rant)

OK, so you're violently opposed to learning something new. Why would that place some sort of burden on ME? You are free to go on wasting time and money on software that is not worth either one. Have fun with the crashes, and the 400,000 viruses.
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Little Billy-Bob's gonna be an astronaut -- the teacher says he's a-takin' up space!


I have nothing against Linux, or new things. I am "violently opposed" to people who use shitty arguments, insults, and rhetorical language to try to get their point across. You are misusing and abusing the language when you do this. You wish to change people's minds, but you have proven you have no idea how to argue with people in a mature manner.

The burden of proof is on you because you chose to make a statement through your post, that Linux is a superior OS, and that Windows categorically sucks at everything. You haven't bothered to support that statement at all in your post. You also made a lot of allegations and inflammatory statements about the company. If you want to prove a point, prove it with factual evidence, not insults. You did not understand a single point of my previous post, did you? Did you even read it?

As for "paying," you really didn't read, did you? I haven't paid for Windows, as I stated in my first post. I have never paid for Windows. Nor have I gotten any serious viruses in years, aside from some malware garbage that crops up occasionally. The last time was the late 90's, and I fixed it myself. Stop with the over-exaggerations. 400,000, indeed.

I can count on one hand my current computer has crashed, and it's usually my fault for trying to do about 15 things at once. I will agree Windows isn't the greatest, but you've done absolutely nothing to convince me that Linux is better.

Basically, put up or shut up. With real, mature, actual evidence, arguments and comparisons, or just find yourself on the ignore list, which even Lord Skimper isn't on. At least he tries to defend his creations in a mature manner, even if he does keep hitting his head on the brick wall well after it's been dismissed by everyone, including the author.
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Re: Linux vs Winblows
Post by Eyal   » Thu Feb 27, 2014 8:27 am

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I should also point out, regarding the issue of application costs, that there's nothing inherent about Windows or Microsoft that prevents software from being free (and in fact you can find free alternatives for many of the more common applications - web browsers are a good example). If Linux were to dominate the market the way Windows does, a much larger proportion of its applications would not be freely available. Case in point - if you need relatively specialized commercial software, then assuming the Windows version is paid the Lniux version will likely be so as well.
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Re: Linux vs Winblows
Post by Imaginos1892   » Thu Feb 27, 2014 9:22 pm

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Uroboros wrote:(Another rant)

Wow, what an outburst of defensive rage. Reminds me of when I called an ex-girlfriend on her compulsive shopping.

You complained about ms win-blows. I had to deal with the same problems, and solved them in the only way it can be done - by removing the cause. If you would rather just keep complaining, well, have at it.

Last time I saw an estimate of the number of win-blows viruses, back in 2008 or so, it was up to over 260,000. I'd be surprised if it was less than 400,000 today.

Never paid for ms win-blows? Or ms-office? Outhouse? So, you've never, ever bought a computer? What are you using to post your tantrums, then?
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Re: Linux vs Winblows
Post by smr   » Fri Feb 28, 2014 5:23 am

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1) Convince the potential customer rather than slander everyone's intelligence.

2) Is Linux designed for average human with no interest in learning a new system? What are the costs to convert for a small company using programs that still work! If not why convert because it does not make economic sense.

3) For individual who hates viruses, it makes sense if they have the technical inclination. However, most people just want to system to work which Windows does.

4) If everything you claim is true, why are business's not converting. What is stopping people from using Linux. Trust me, people would convert if the economics make sense.
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