Stories you wish were told?

Weird Harold wrote:

Jonathan_S wrote:I guess you could go radically the other way, and (if you've got access to Manticore-Lite tech) go for a somewhat smaller and much more survivable Wayfairer layout, where you use LACs to actually run down and force the pirates to surrender. But you can't go too small and still carry more than 1 or 2 LACs.

Consider that Sidemore's navy started out as a short squadron of obsolete cruisers and half of Wayfarer's LAC complement with a couple dozen pods in orbit for close in defense.

Given that kind of starting point, with more advanced LACs than any other ship type, Sidemore might well go for a LAC heavy anti-pirate force with CLACs (maybe downsized to escort carrier size) and LACs as advanced as they can obtain or design.

A CLAC would provide all of the hospital, brig, boarding parties, etc mentioned above, with the speed and numerical advantage advanced LACs provide to bring pirates to bay.

Tha Sidemore navy looks decent but I would get some more warships with the League War and the distinct threat of better armed pirates arising. Lacs are good against armed merchant ships, frigates and destroyers but IMO even SL cruisers would be problematic for a LAC force, especially one with older LACs

kzt wrote:How many Nimitz class carriers do you think should be stationed off the coast of Somalia to keep the seas free of the threat of 4 guys with AKs in a 20 foot speed boat?

Just one, because that's pretty much the smallest we have.

Sidemore doesn't need a "Nimitz Class" CLAC (although they may name their CLAC class after a certain furry celery thief) they would need smaller carriers and smaller LAC complements for anti-pirate patrols. "Escort Carrier" sized ships embarking only one or two squadrons instead of multiple wings.

Weird Harold wrote:

kzt wrote:How many Nimitz class carriers do you think should be stationed off the coast of Somalia to keep the seas free of the threat of 4 guys with AKs in a 20 foot speed boat?

Just one, because that's pretty much the smallest we have.

Sidemore doesn't need a "Nimitz Class" CLAC (although they may name their CLAC class after a certain furry celery thief) they would need smaller carriers and smaller LAC complements for anti-pirate patrols. "Escort Carrier" sized ships embarking only one or two squadrons instead of multiple wings.

Why would Sidemore need any of that now? Piracy in the area is trending down drastically post-Silesia reapportionment. Give it 5 years and the Silesia region will be the quietist in space.

All Sidemore will need is a nice SDF and a handful of light ships for "routine" commerce protection.

As for Somalia, I say use the first 2 America class LPAs with Harriers/F-35s, MV-22s and Cobras. (2 ships = quicker response times)

Theemile wrote:Why would Sidemore need any of that now? Piracy in the area is trending down drastically post-Silesia reapportionment. Give it 5 years and the Silesia region will be the quietist in space.

All Sidemore will need is a nice SDF and a handful of light ships for "routine" commerce protection.

Sidemore probably doesn't need "any of that" now. But the requested story was pre-partition and as a Manticoran Ally engaged in piracy suppression in the area.

It might be worth noting that Sidemore is NOT part of Silesia and a crackdown on pirates and corruption in the Silesian Protectorates by both the IAN and RMN could well force piracy to move outside of the Silesian Protectorates. Sidemore might well need more anti-piracy capability instead of less.

kzt wrote:How many Nimitz class carriers do you think should be stationed off the coast of Somalia to keep the seas free of the threat of 4 guys with AKs in a 20 foot speed boat?

To be fair the pirates in the Honorverse are more like high speed ferrys with surplus 75mm guns stuck on the deck.

They've got a lot more endurance and firepower that a speed boat with AKs; or even RPGs.

Weird Harold wrote:It might be worth noting that Sidemore is NOT part of Silesia and a crackdown on pirates and corruption in the Silesian Protectorates by both the IAN and RMN could well force piracy to move outside of the Silesian Protectorates. Sidemore might well need more anti-piracy capability instead of less.

I tend to doubt it. With Silesia getting cleaned up the Pirates lost not only their primary hunting grounds but also their sources of refit and supply, and their buyers. There's probably not enough traffic just outside the borders of Silesia to support pirates, and without their contacts to fence the spoils they'd be hard pressed to continue operating even if they was enough prey.

There might be a very short term spike in piracy, but I'd image they'd have to move on to some other semi-dense corrupt area pretty quickly. Otherwise finances would kill them even if anti-piracy patrols couldn't.

Weird Harold wrote:

Theemile wrote:Why would Sidemore need any of that now? Piracy in the area is trending down drastically post-Silesia reapportionment. Give it 5 years and the Silesia region will be the quietist in space.

All Sidemore will need is a nice SDF and a handful of light ships for "routine" commerce protection.

Sidemore probably doesn't need "any of that" now. But the requested story was pre-partition and as a Manticoran Ally engaged in piracy suppression in the area.

It might be worth noting that Sidemore is NOT part of Silesia and a crackdown on pirates and corruption in the Silesian Protectorates by both the IAN and RMN could well force piracy to move outside of the Silesian Protectorates. Sidemore might well need more anti-piracy capability instead of less.

All of that is very true, although I don't think that pirates have ever been all that bothered by national borders...

Jonathan_S wrote:I guess you could go radically the other way, and (if you've got access to Manticore-Lite tech) go for a somewhat smaller and much more survivable Wayfairer layout, where you use LACs to actually run down and force the pirates to surrender. But you can't go too small and still carry more than 1 or 2 LACs. If you dock nose first, a LAC is longer than a CA is wide; you'd probably want something in the 2 mton range as even an escort-CLAC. Still even if the ships aren't much different from everyone else's warships the training and culture of a anti-piracy force could still be an interesting difference to read about.

I don't think LACs would still dock nose first with escort carriers - unless the CVE is asymmetrical or its LAC bays are fly-through. If you're not building all-up CLACs, you don't want the width penalty working against your acceleration advantage.

A quick look in HoS' stats and a CVE based roughly on the Agamemnon's dimensions might be able to fit 6x3 side-docked LAC bays per broadside. Call it about 30-36 total. There'd be more free width between the two broadsides than on a Hydra too.

munroburton wrote:

Jonathan_S wrote:I guess you could go radically the other way, and (if you've got access to Manticore-Lite tech) go for a somewhat smaller and much more survivable Wayfairer layout, where you use LACs to actually run down and force the pirates to surrender. But you can't go too small and still carry more than 1 or 2 LACs. If you dock nose first, a LAC is longer than a CA is wide; you'd probably want something in the 2 mton range as even an escort-CLAC. Still even if the ships aren't much different from everyone else's warships the training and culture of a anti-piracy force could still be an interesting difference to read about.

I don't think LACs would still dock nose first with escort carriers - unless the CVE is asymmetrical or its LAC bays are fly-through. If you're not building all-up CLACs, you don't want the width penalty working against your acceleration advantage.

A quick look in HoS' stats and a CVE based roughly on the Agamemnon's dimensions might be able to fit 6x3 side-docked LAC bays per broadside. Call it about 30-36 total. There'd be more free width between the two broadsides than on a Hydra too.

Yeah, Shrikes/Ferrets/Katanas all dock nose first - that's where all their umbilicals are.

David said awhile back that the size of a LAC and LAC bay costs a CLAC about 32 tons - I do not know if spares and consummables are counted in that #. And... this comes out of a ship's weapons or cargo capacity.

Assume we wanted a CA sized CLAC...

If you consider that ~33% of a traditional light warship is used as weapons and defenses (I believe this # is high for a traditional design, and it's a sliding scale based upon mass, but we have to use something); That means of a 300,000 ton CA, 100,000 tons is used for the weapons, defenses, ECM, sidewalls, etc. If you subtract the mass of the 2 LAC bays, only 36 ktons is available for the weps and defenses on the ship - so your CA will have the protection and teeth of a 108 Kton CL... and 2 LACs.

And that's supposing you find a way to fit the LACs in.

I played with the Beam ratios awhile back, and you have to have a merchant hull in the 4.5 Mton range in order to have symmetric broadsides of perpendicular LAC bays like a Minotaur has, and that configuration would allow ~40 LACS. ~2Mtons on a merchant hull, you could go with staggered Broadsides for a total of about 12-16 LACS, ~2.5-3 Mtons would allow for angled bays allowing ~20 LACS.

Jonathan_S wrote:I guess you could go radically the other way, and (if you've got access to Manticore-Lite tech) go for a somewhat smaller and much more survivable Wayfairer layout, where you use LACs to actually run down and force the pirates to surrender. But you can't go too small and still carry more than 1 or 2 LACs. If you dock nose first, a LAC is longer than a CA is wide; you'd probably want something in the 2 mton range as even an escort-CLAC. Still even if the ships aren't much different from everyone else's warships the training and culture of a anti-piracy force could still be an interesting difference to read about.

I like the idea of a Q-ship fleet of LAC carriers. Give them armor, military compensators, grasers, missiles and the biggest EW suite you can cram in, and half a dozen LAC bays. The Q-ship plays "bait", acting like a merchie target, and when the pirates pop up, lure them in and whack'em. You would need extra brig space, accommodation for prize crews, and facilities for a court of law on board to try the pirates on the spot. Also, medical and housing for freed slaves.

I also think that proper intel would do wonders for the effort. Treat it like an organized crime investigation, monitor high-value cargoes and even cruise ahead of a likely target's itinerary, using EW to imitate its signature. Track the buyers and collaborators in local government.

Just thought of another story I'd like: Preston of the Spaceways! Maybe even in comic-book form.