House of Lies/Honorverse Companion 2

Michael Riddell wrote:

Lord Skimper wrote:Can we see any of the ships in multiple perspectives this time? If any. Side top down bottom up end on...

I'd like that too.

Mike.

No need. You can go to my Deviant Art page linked below and see orthos of the Fearless. Ship designs are all based on the same principles, so they all more or less look the same, with the only *real* differences being in size and number of weapons ports.

lyonheart wrote:The appendix in TSVW was based on different assumptions from 20+ years ago, before Eric Flint's 'From The Highlands' changed and accelerated the honorverse dynamic, so rather than the recent build up in HoS, it postulated ships built over a much longer time, with much less sudden technical improvement until the war.

According to posts at the bar, the numbers of peep ships went up from ~1944 to 2106 when a ~20% margin wasn't enough, but it fit very well.

I at least spent a lot of time figuring with it.

The build-up was 50 years long before, wasn't it? Starting when Basilisk was annexed. So how long did it take now?

Hi SCC,

The implication from the early textev was that many the ships were much older than the updated history suggests, since the RMN SD average was just over 7 MT, while the peep's was 6.8 etc.

Given how valuable the WHJ was, the idea the SKM hardly had any wallers before the 1860's seems almost laughable.

From the previous history of UHH etc the main domestic issue before Haven went conquistador around 1846 PD was handling the long term effects of prolong on retirement planning, to ensure people could take of themselves, which apparently took almost 20 years to thrash out, but so far seems to be working.

L

SCC wrote:

lyonheart wrote:The appendix in TSVW was based on different assumptions from 20+ years ago, before Eric Flint's 'From The Highlands' changed and accelerated the honorverse dynamic, so rather than the recent build up in HoS, it postulated ships built over a much longer time, with much less sudden technical improvement until the war.

According to posts at the bar, the numbers of peep ships went up from ~1944 to 2106 when a ~20% margin wasn't enough, but it fit very well.

I at least spent a lot of time figuring with it.

The build-up was 50 years long before, wasn't it? Starting when Basilisk was annexed. So how long did it take now?

Given how valuable the WHJ was, the idea the SKM hardly had any wallers before the 1860's seems almost laughable.

Why? The RMN in 1860 would absolutely dominate practically any other Verge power. Very few Verge powers had capital ships at all, so the RMN was well ahead of the curve when looking at any likely threats. Wallers are incredibly expensive, so why build gads of them if you don't need them?

Duckk wrote:

Given how valuable the WHJ was, the idea the SKM hardly had any wallers before the 1860's seems almost laughable.

Why? The RMN in 1860 would absolutely dominate practically any other Verge power. Very few Verge powers had capital ships at all, so the RMN was well ahead of the curve when looking at any likely threats. Wallers are incredibly expensive, so why build gads of them if you don't need them?

And indeed, if you look at the other wormholes we've seen, especially in ART, the defenses are anything from weak to non-existant (except for Beowulf, and they are something of a special case).

Now of course a lot of that may be from faith that the ISLN would ride to the rescue if anybody tried what manticore is doing, but still, wormholes don't necessarily equal heavy defense in the Honorverse.

Duckk wrote:

Given how valuable the WHJ was, the idea the SKM hardly had any wallers before the 1860's seems almost laughable.

Why? The RMN in 1860 would absolutely dominate practically any other Verge power. Very few Verge powers had capital ships at all, so the RMN was well ahead of the curve when looking at any likely threats. Wallers are incredibly expensive, so why build gads of them if you don't need them?

Quite True, in the early 1800s PD, the RMN had 11 BBs 11 DNs and 3 SDs - 25 Capitolships

MWW said that in 1900 having 25 capitol ships placed you in the largest 25 navies - most of which were in the SL. So the force King Roger inherited was a galactically potent force, if not a modern one and certainly not the top 5 navy it is currently.

Lyonheart ---

When you are prepared to go through and spend as much time and effort as the Bu9 guys did on creating/recreating the "historical" navy by wading through 20 years worth of books and attempting to reconcile all the minor continuity errors which have crept in over the last 20 decades you may be in a position to cast aspersions on their efforts. At the moment, you are not.

RFC --

Ooh Rah

stewart wrote:Lyonheart ---

When you are prepared to go through and spend as much time and effort as the Bu9 guys did on creating/recreating the "historical" navy by wading through 20 years worth of books and attempting to reconcile all the minor continuity errors which have crept in over the last 20 decades you may be in a position to cast aspersions on their efforts. At the moment, you are not.

RFC --

Ooh Rah

Ooops!

And thank you.

stewart wrote:Lyonheart ---

When you are prepared to go through and spend as much time and effort as the Bu9 guys did on creating/recreating the "historical" navy by wading through 20 years worth of books and attempting to reconcile all the minor continuity errors which have crept in over the last 20 decades you may be in a position to cast aspersions on their efforts. At the moment, you are not.

RFC --

Ooh Rah

Even with the typo, I'd say Game, Set and Match to Mr Weber.

Mike.

Guys,

You seem to be missing my points.

I am such a fan of the MWW, [RFC} and the honorverse he created that I don't think that the early details should be dismissed so cavalierly.

While RFC may not feel it's not quite sacrilege , I have yet to be convinced , and yes I'm amused by how various attitudes have changed since I first visited the bar 9 years ago.

No one has yet to explain where the early details of the SVW appendix in particular were so wrong, ie why so much in HoS was simply invented regarding classes and their tonnages when the original data could have framed and guided what they came up with, which you might have noticed if you had paid attention.

Please feel welcome to try.

But first you might want to pay attention to the textev.

For example in SoS the Avalon class was stated to be a third the size of the Hexapuma, ie 161,000 tons; not almost 10% less, so why the change?

L

Michael Riddell wrote:

stewart wrote:Lyonheart ---

When you are prepared to go through and spend as much time and effort as the Bu9 guys did on creating/recreating the "historical" navy by wading through 20 years worth of books and attempting to reconcile all the minor continuity errors which have crept in over the last 20 decades you may be in a position to cast aspersions on their efforts. At the moment, you are not.

RFC --

Ooh Rah

Even with the typo, I'd say Game, Set and Match to Mr Weber.

Mike.