Detweiler Vision vs Beowulf Code: "Right" and "Wrong"

cthia wrote:Another excellent stance. IMHO. I see prolong as the one muddy area. The fulcrum. The pivot point. The crux. And prolong very well may represent Beowulf's first cautious step since their original posture.

Ok, here's a morality question: suppose that the Mesan work on genetics from their slave lines exposed a fix for the inability of the Meyerdahl mod to regenerate. Does Allison treat Honor with it?

-- Bob G

cthia wrote:
Another excellent stance. IMHO. I see prolong as the one muddy area. The fulcrum. The pivot point. The crux. And prolong very well may represent Beowulf's first cautious step since their original posture.

The regeneration therapies (which I imagine tap into unused or inactivated parts of the human genome) might be another of those steps.

People, prolong does not violate the Beowolf Code, it is not a gene mod, it is a, mostly, single generation, epigenetic change, prolong literally convinces the body not to age. This part of the reason the mesan life extention mods stack with prolong. As for fixing nonresponsiveness to regen, it is not going beyond the natural limits, and in a universe where only a minority of people do not respond, it is pretty much the definition of a disease state.

HungryKing wrote:People, prolong does not violate the Beowolf Code, it is not a gene mod, it is a, mostly, single generation, epigenetic change, prolong literally convinces the body not to age. This part of the reason the mesan life extention mods stack with prolong. As for fixing nonresponsiveness to regen, it is not going beyond the natural limits, and in a universe where only a minority of people do not respond, it is pretty much the definition of a disease state.

I wasn't sure whether or not prolong violated Beowulf's own code with respect to the particular gene sequence. However it is still in question whether their overall stance has been impuned. An expert Mesan legal lawyer (in the league of SWM) could eat Beowulf alive on this issue. At the very least the judge will rule on Mesa's right to a hearing on the merits of their case.

The Beowulf Life Sciences Code, which limited genetic engineering to the purpose of curing and counteracting existing conditions and discouraged the intentional "improvement" of the species...

robertamgottlieb wrote:

cthia wrote:Another excellent stance. IMHO. I see prolong as the one muddy area. The fulcrum. The pivot point. The crux. And prolong very well may represent Beowulf's first cautious step since their original posture.

Ok, here's a morality question: suppose that the Mesan work on genetics from their slave lines exposed a fix for the inability of the Heyerdahl mod to regenerate. Does Allison treat Honor with it?

-- Bob G

I am not quite so sure that this is a question of morality. Or at least if it were, that ship has sailed.

My personal slant on regeneration. If I were a high-powered high falutin lawyer like, SWM, I would argue that regen does not, in any way compromise Beowulf's stance. Regen does not replace anything in or on the body that isn't already there. In fact, regen is nothing more than a highly skilled surgeon in a bottle, with bandaids.

If I lose a finger today, as long as I put that finger on ice and get it to a proper surgeon, it can be reattached. Giving me no more than I had before said accident. Regen, arguably, is just a high-tech scalpel and sutures. IMHO.

However, if that cure for the Meyerdahl mod exists outside the approved gene sequence, then that presents a problem. If you make a stance then you must be aware that if you step outside of your own parameters then you establish a precedent, eliminating your argument against, thereby opening the door. In that case Beowulf would have transformed their nonarbitrary limit to an arbitrary one, thus killing all that they stood for, by providing an exploitable legal and logical loophole.

It's akin to the SLN saying 'do as I say, not as I do.'

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robertamgottlieb wrote:

cthia wrote:Another excellent stance. IMHO. I see prolong as the one muddy area. The fulcrum. The pivot point. The crux. And prolong very well may represent Beowulf's first cautious step since their original posture.

Ok, here's a morality question: suppose that the Mesan work on genetics from their slave lines exposed a fix for the inability of the Heyerdahl mod to regenerate. Does Allison treat Honor with it?

-- Bob G

Excellent point

robertamgottlieb wrote:

cthia wrote:Another excellent stance. IMHO. I see prolong as the one muddy area. The fulcrum. The pivot point. The crux. And prolong very well may represent Beowulf's first cautious step since their original posture.

Ok, here's a morality question: suppose that the Mesan work on genetics from their slave lines exposed a fix for the inability of the Heyerdahl mod to regenerate. Does Allison treat Honor with it?

-- Bob G

I thought it was Meyerdahl, but ... Do we have textev of Alfred regenerating or not? I don't recall the failure to take regen being intrinsic to that mod, but it could just be me.

Dca wrote:I thought it was Meyerdahl, but ... Do we have textev of Alfred regenerating or not? I don't recall the failure to take regen being intrinsic to that mod, but it could just be me.

Heyerdahl vs Meyerbdahl - I blame the iPhone auto-spell correct. Sorry.

-- Bob G

robertamgottlieb wrote:

Dca wrote:I thought it was Meyerdahl, but ... Do we have textev of Alfred regenerating or not? I don't recall the failure to take regen being intrinsic to that mod, but it could just be me.

Heyerdahl vs Meyerbdahl - I blame the iPhone auto-spell correct. Sorry.

-- Bob G

For me it was just a matter of blind leading the blind. I actually thought there was a gene sequence I wasn't aware of.

cthia wrote:I am not quite so sure that this is a question of morality. Or at least if it were, that ship has sailed.

My personal slant on regeneration. If I were a high-powered high falutin lawyer like, SWM, I would argue that regen does not, in any way compromise Beowulf's stance. Regen does not replace anything in or on the body that isn't already there. In fact, regen is nothing more than a highly skilled surgeon in a bottle, with bandaids.

If I lose a finger today, as long as I put that finger on ice and get it to a proper surgeon, it can be reattached. Giving me no more than I had before said accident. Regen, arguably, is just a high-tech scalpel and sutures. IMHO.

However, if that cure for the Heyerdahl mod exists outside the approved gene sequence, then that presents a problem. If you make a stance then you must be aware that if you step outside of your own parameters then you establish a precedent, eliminating your argument against, thereby opening the door. In that case Beowulf would have transformed their nonarbitrary limit to an arbitrary one, thus killing all that they stood for, by providing an exploitable legal and logical loophole.

It's akin to the SLN saying 'do as I say, not as I do.'

I think you miss my point. I wasn't talking about whether genetic mods for prolog are acceptable under the Beowulf code, but rather it is moral or not to use knowledge acquired through such an evil basis.

There was, IIRC, some valuable medical research on hypothermia acquired from experiments (i.e., scientific torture) on prisoners at Auschwitz. That was the first time I encountered this issue: what do you do with useful medical knowledge acquired from an atrocity? And I certainly consider the entire enterprise of genetic slavery as a way to acquire detailed knowledge of human genetics an atrocity.

-- Bob G