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Lord Skimper wrote:As noted displacement mass in HoS is not the same as mass weight. It is a measure of how much water Or in the Honorverse alcohol it would displace.

Alcohol as the 0.25 rule. If it were water it would be closer to 0.35.

Displacement mass is a measure of space.

As such in a cube length times width times height. Times by 0.25 or divided by 4. A Shrike is roughly cylindrical 72 metres by 19 by 20 metres. The maximum displacement of a ship would be no more than 6840 tons. Likely less. Closer to 5000 displacement tons. As BuNine noted the LAC numbers in HoS are off compared to the other ships.

Otherwise the shrike would displace more than the larger highlander. Remember displace not weight. A shrike is not a Tardus and a shrike is un armoured. It doesn't have a higher density. It might have less empty space, but the density of what it has isn't any higher than on any other un armoured ship.

As for a frigate being 60000 tons that would be great as a grav lance would fit a gravlance and 8? Energy torpedoes plus crew etc... Fit on a 88000 ton ship.

Again Displacement not weight. This is why an empty freighter accelerates at the same speed as a fully laden freighter. In the Honorverse.

Lord Skimper wrote:As noted displacement mass in HoS is not the same as mass weight. It is a measure of how much water Or in the Honorverse alcohol it would displace.

Alcohol as the 0.25 rule. If it were water it would be closer to 0.35.

Displacement mass is a measure of space.

As such in a cube length times width times height. Times by 0.25 or divided by 4. A Shrike is roughly cylindrical 72 metres by 19 by 20 metres. The maximum displacement of a ship would be no more than 6840 tons. Likely less. Closer to 5000 displacement tons. As BuNine noted the LAC numbers in HoS are off compared to the other ships.

Otherwise the shrike would displace more than the larger highlander. Remember displace not weight. A shrike is not a Tardus and a shrike is un armoured. It doesn't have a higher density. It might have less empty space, but the density of what it has isn't any higher than on any other un armoured ship.

As for a frigate being 60000 tons that would be great as a grav lance would fit a gravlance and 8? Energy torpedoes plus crew etc... Fit on a 88000 ton ship.

Again Displacement not weight. This is why an empty freighter accelerates at the same speed as a fully laden freighter. In the Honorverse.

kzt wrote:I think KH2s are absurdly large, like DD size.

SWM wrote:

kzt wrote:I think KH2s are absurdly large, like DD size.

Hm. Actually, you're right. I was using the information from the Wiki, which quotes a mass of 20,000 tons for KHII. But it looks like that may be wrong. This Pearl, http://infodump.thefifthimperium.com/en ... gton/283/1, says that the final version of KHI was 65,000 tons (almost the size of a destroyer), and KHII is larger still.

The length doesn't seem to fit the diagrams in HoS, though. Compare the size of Keyhole II to the total length of the Invictus class. The KHII appears to be about 1/5 the total length of the podnought. That makes it around 260 meters length. But the Noblesse-class destroyer (only 68,000 tons) is 350 meters long. This would work if the KHII is the weight of a destroyer and a density similar to a LAC.

SWM wrote:

kzt wrote:I think KH2s are absurdly large, like DD size.

Hm. Actually, you're right. I was using the information from the Wiki, which quotes a mass of 20,000 tons for KHII. But it looks like that may be wrong. This Pearl, http://infodump.thefifthimperium.com/en ... gton/283/1, says that the final version of KHI was 65,000 tons (almost the size of a destroyer), and KHII is larger still.

The length doesn't seem to fit the diagrams in HoS, though. Compare the size of Keyhole II to the total length of the Invictus class. The KHII appears to be about 1/5 the total length of the podnought. That makes it around 260 meters length. But the Noblesse-class destroyer (only 68,000 tons) is 350 meters long. This would work if the KHII is the weight of a destroyer and a density similar to a LAC.

J6P wrote:STOP:

Did RFC not recently post that the OVERALL density is a volume for the compensator? Actual mass of the ship can be much greater. FOREX: BOMA1. 600 pods + mass of SD = Well above the 0.25ton/m^3 density.

Density within volume will vary depending on systems in question.

KH1/KH2, will be any density you wish. Adherring to 0.25 as defined by the compensator volume density, while straightforward would not make sense.

Militarily speaking: Volume of KH wants to be miniscule. Smaller profile. Less chance of being hit. Density should be maximized.

For all we know, KH could have a density of 1.5. Not unthinkable. FTL control links are what???

SWM wrote:

J6P wrote:STOP:

Did RFC not recently post that the OVERALL density is a volume for the compensator? Actual mass of the ship can be much greater. FOREX: BOMA1. 600 pods + mass of SD = Well above the 0.25ton/m^3 density.

Density within volume will vary depending on systems in question.

KH1/KH2, will be any density you wish. Adherring to 0.25 as defined by the compensator volume density, while straightforward would not make sense.

Militarily speaking: Volume of KH wants to be miniscule. Smaller profile. Less chance of being hit. Density should be maximized.

For all we know, KH could have a density of 1.5. Not unthinkable. FTL control links are what???

Sure. We do understand that. But the point is that it looks like a Keyhole has physical dimensions considerably smaller than a destroyer. And it is the physical size of a Keyhole compared to a destroyer which has been the point in contention.

So, to put it plainly, a destroyer will not fit inside a Keyhole bay.