Solly Fleet Advancements

n7axw wrote:If you are commerce raiding the only band you concern yourself with is the Alpha band because your prey are freighters and most of them can't operate higher.

Actually, I think most merchant ships operate in the Delta bands -- at least that's where Gisgard set his pickets in the Selkar Rift, IIRC.

I think very few ships actually travel in the alpha band and those that do probably aren't a significant enough part of a star system's trade to waste a squadron of commerce raiders on.

n7axw wrote:If you are commerce raiding the only band you concern yourself with is the Alpha band because your prey are freighters and most of them can't operate higher.

No, average merchantmen can get into Delta, which has an effective multiplier of 1089 C for them.

kzt wrote:

wastedfly wrote:This, keep your hyper units inside the hyper limit is beyond stupid. All or near all of the active RMN/RHN units should be outside the hyper limit. With pods tractored and ready to go. They already have the acceleration and range advantage. May as well grab the time(response time) advantage as well.

It's not that everyone in the Honorverse isn't as smart as you are, it's that this isn't how Honorverse forces work. You try to have the ships deployed and active 100% the ships will break down and readiness will go to hell.

Yup. Take the most extreme position. One that makes no rational sense.

Those that are active and deployed should be. Those who are not with active impellers will be in orbit. It takes 45 min to fire up all systems after all. Be pretty stupid to have your forces at the hyper limit with no power where a graser armed Frigate can drop in on top of you and blow you away...

At least make it so the SLN can't pull an AAC prelude which for them would be free as they have thousands upon thousands of light units. Or should, though with corruption, they may not as building SD's are much preferable when skimming

All this pre-supposes that the League lasts linger than the first half of the next book...

Beowulf's secession is going to throw the cat among the pigeons what ever happens with the SLN taskforce.

We know the League is pretty much going to start disintegrating anyway, and sending in the SLN is going to annoy those who stood by Beowulf...

WLBjork wrote:All this pre-supposes that the League lasts linger than the first half of the next book...

Beowulf's secession is going to throw the cat among the pigeons what ever happens with the SLN taskforce.

We know the League is pretty much going to start disintegrating anyway, and sending in the SLN is going to annoy those who stood by Beowulf...

Well, the books always turn things off in different directions that one might think, that's what makes them interesting.

And I think the assumption that the League is actually going to disintegrate may or may not actually happen. We know the Alignment needs to League to disintegrate in order to proceed with their master plan, but just as there are forces attempting to pull the League apart, there are going to be other forces trying to hold it together. We don't see those forces all that much because the books don't show them in much detail but they will be there. It's just a matter of which of these sets of forces, and the events around them, will be strongest in the end.

Alizon wrote:And I think the assumption that the League is actually going to disintegrate may or may not actually happen. We know the Alignment needs to League to disintegrate in order to proceed with their master plan, but just as there are forces attempting to pull the League apart, there are going to be other forces trying to hold it together. We don't see those forces all that much because the books don't show them in much detail but they will be there. It's just a matter of which of these sets of forces, and the events around them, will be strongest in the end.

Really, I think the main reason why the League is going to fall apart is that there are lots of forces trying to pull it apart (external pressure from both Manticore and the Alignment, overt secessionist movements in the protectorates, a covert secessionist movement in Maya, a founding deep core system leaving in Beowulf, all sorts of political differences that the League keeps buried, the fundamental flaws in the League's government structure) and pretty much none holding it together. There's not really anyone willing to fight and die to preserve the League (though senior League officials are willing to send others out to do that).

I think that there would be PLENTY of people wanting to hold the league together.

Many core worlds (even the "good" democratic ones) would have plenty of reasons to see a reform of the league or maybe a replacement that does the same thing better, rather than its destruction.

Think about it the core worlds have had to pay just a pittance of there G.S.P on defence and foreign affairs because of the existence of the league.

If the league breaks up into scores of succession states that "free ride" on defence ends.

An analogy could be given of the U.S.A and my home country New Zealand

Since World war 2 NZs defence spending has steadily dropped in real terms and we don't even have any combat aircraft anymore why?

Answer in part U.S Naval supremacy our exports can go on ships protected (indirectly) by the U.S Navy.

So while in NZ there are plenty of people on the streets who (sadly) don't like America those in power know that America supremacy gives stability and is better than its replacement (China?).

Same for the league in honourverse

If I were a good democrat on a core world despite the many, many grievous faults of the SL I would not be eager to simply join everyone in throwing the SL under the train because despite the SL sins it still has given stability and interstellar peace for literally thousands of years!!

I would use the current situation to either reform it or create a replacement that still leaves the League in top dog place.

In essence just as WW2 finished off the league of nations and paved the way for the United nations. the current war could finish off the league but many of the key players will want to see a replacement that gives them the advantages of the current regime.

And they would rather stick with the league then have it replaced by interstellar "dark age" where successor states routinely nuke planets and every core world planet has to have large fleets of SDs just to protect its existence.

Alistair wrote:If I were a good democrat on a core world despite the many, many grievous faults of the SL I would not be eager to simply join everyone in throwing the SL under the train because despite the SL sins it still has given stability and interstellar peace for literally thousands of years!!

Which is great, but right now, sticking with the League means you're at war with a coalition that
1) Has a way, way more advanced military that's big enough that you can't come close to overwhelming with numbers any time soon
2) Has seized the wormhole network and crippled interstellar trade
3) Has made it clear that anyone who quits the League will be free to trade through the wormhole network again

drothgery wrote: Which is great, but right now, sticking with the League means you're at war with a coalition that
1) Has a way, way more advanced military that's big enough that you can't come close to overwhelming with numbers any time soon
2) Has seized the wormhole network and crippled interstellar trade
3) Has made it clear that anyone who quits the League will be free to trade through the wormhole network again

So I'll join up with a very similar organization. I hear there is one called the Renaissance something or other....

Alistair wrote:I think that there would be PLENTY of people wanting to hold the league together.

Many core worlds (even the "good" democratic ones) would have plenty of reasons to see a reform of the league or maybe a replacement that does the same thing better, rather than its destruction.

Think about it the core worlds have had to pay just a pittance of there G.S.P on defence and foreign affairs because of the existence of the league.

If the league breaks up into scores of succession states that "free ride" on defence ends.

An analogy could be given of the U.S.A and my home country New Zealand

Since World war 2 NZs defence spending has steadily dropped in real terms and we don't even have any combat aircraft anymore why?

Answer in part U.S Naval supremacy our exports can go on ships protected (indirectly) by the U.S Navy.

So while in NZ there are plenty of people on the streets who (sadly) don't like America those in power know that America supremacy gives stability and is better than its replacement (China?).

Same for the league in honourverse

If I were a good democrat on a core world despite the many, many grievous faults of the SL I would not be eager to simply join everyone in throwing the SL under the train because despite the SL sins it still has given stability and interstellar peace for literally thousands of years!!

I would use the current situation to either reform it or create a replacement that still leaves the League in top dog place.

In essence just as WW2 finished off the league of nations and paved the way for the United nations. the current war could finish off the league but many of the key players will want to see a replacement that gives them the advantages of the current regime.

And they would rather stick with the league then have it replaced by interstellar "dark age" where successor states routinely nuke planets and every core world planet has to have large fleets of SDs just to protect its existence.

The problem with that line of logic is that it is all League-wide, long-term thinking. If they stick together, they have a chance, a good one, but only if.
Individual planetary governments don't think about future defense budgets, and even if they do, it is easier for each and all to let the others burden the load of the war, and make a separate deal.
Sticking your head out for the SL seems like a good to invite a Manty raiding fleet, and once the first begin to flee the league, the rest will follow out of panic.