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Honorverse ramblings and musings

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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by Jonathan_S   » Sun Oct 18, 2015 1:38 am

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kzt wrote:The last post brought up something that we tend to overlook. There is a huge distinction between those people and systems that Mancticore is responsible for and those who they might choose to do something nice for.

If you want to get protected by the RMN the solution is to join the SEM. Which requires you to apply and get accepted - which requires you agree to subordinate your government to the Empire, pay taxes to the SEM, accept the basing of Imperial military units and Imperial law enforcement, accept an Imperial Governor and modify your government as needed to satisfy the SEM.

If haven't joined the SEM the SEM has no obligation to do anything for you no matter how much awful stuff happens. If they chose to show up and do something to help (or harm - if they see that as needed) they have no obligation to stick around and "make things right". There are no pottery barn rules that Manticore has agreed to.
Well there's a middle zone of systems that Manticore might make some level of alliance with. But they aren't going to hand those out to just anyone; because their resources won't stretch to being the Galaxy's policeman.

But if they do offer a treaty or alliance I'm sure they'll do the best in their power to honor it.
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by roseandheather   » Sun Oct 18, 2015 4:26 pm

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Jonathan_S wrote:
kzt wrote:The last post brought up something that we tend to overlook. There is a huge distinction between those people and systems that Mancticore is responsible for and those who they might choose to do something nice for.

If you want to get protected by the RMN the solution is to join the SEM. Which requires you to apply and get accepted - which requires you agree to subordinate your government to the Empire, pay taxes to the SEM, accept the basing of Imperial military units and Imperial law enforcement, accept an Imperial Governor and modify your government as needed to satisfy the SEM.

If haven't joined the SEM the SEM has no obligation to do anything for you no matter how much awful stuff happens. If they chose to show up and do something to help (or harm - if they see that as needed) they have no obligation to stick around and "make things right". There are no pottery barn rules that Manticore has agreed to.
Well there's a middle zone of systems that Manticore might make some level of alliance with. But they aren't going to hand those out to just anyone; because their resources won't stretch to being the Galaxy's policeman.

But if they do offer a treaty or alliance I'm sure they'll do the best in their power to honor it.


See also: Grayson and Haven. But those are mutual defense treaties, not unilateral. (As shown by the fact that both nations have saved Manticore's bacon at one time or another.)
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Sun Oct 18, 2015 4:46 pm

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Jonathan_S wrote:
kzt wrote:The last post brought up something that we tend to overlook. There is a huge distinction between those people and systems that Mancticore is responsible for and those who they might choose to do something nice for.

If you want to get protected by the RMN the solution is to join the SEM. Which requires you to apply and get accepted - which requires you agree to subordinate your government to the Empire, pay taxes to the SEM, accept the basing of Imperial military units and Imperial law enforcement, accept an Imperial Governor and modify your government as needed to satisfy the SEM.

If haven't joined the SEM the SEM has no obligation to do anything for you no matter how much awful stuff happens. If they chose to show up and do something to help (or harm - if they see that as needed) they have no obligation to stick around and "make things right". There are no pottery barn rules that Manticore has agreed to.
Well there's a middle zone of systems that Manticore might make some level of alliance with. But they aren't going to hand those out to just anyone; because their resources won't stretch to being the Galaxy's policeman.

But if they do offer a treaty or alliance I'm sure they'll do the best in their power to honor it.

roseandheather wrote:See also: Grayson and Haven. But those are mutual defense treaties, not unilateral. (As shown by the fact that both nations have saved Manticore's bacon at one time or another.)

Mutual, as in bilateral.


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I'm curious. Is there textev regarding how much more acceleration can be achieved regarding current compensator efficiency?

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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by Lord Skimper   » Sun Oct 18, 2015 4:50 pm

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Counterfeit currency. Why is there no Counterfeit currency in the Honorverse?
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by Jonathan_S   » Sun Oct 18, 2015 8:32 pm

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Lord Skimper wrote:Counterfeit currency. Why is there no Counterfeit currency in the Honorverse?

There likely is; some. Just not enough for it to be important enough to show up in any of the stories.

Just like there was counterfit, clipped, or (unofficially) debased currency during the Napoleonic wars - but it didn't seem to come up in Hornblower stories :D At least that I recall
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Mon Oct 19, 2015 7:58 am

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Jonathan_S wrote:
Lord Skimper wrote:Counterfeit currency. Why is there no Counterfeit currency in the Honorverse?

There likely is; some. Just not enough for it to be important enough to show up in any of the stories.

Just like there was counterfit, clipped, or (unofficially) debased currency during the Napoleonic wars - but it didn't seem to come up in Hornblower stories :D At least that I recall

I thought all currency was handled on-chip in the Honorverse. Does textev offer examples of actual paper monies?

Aside:
The chip versions of Honorverse cards are just coming online here on Earth now. This year saw all of my bank cards fitted with the new chip. The birth of Honorverse chips?

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by kzt   » Mon Oct 19, 2015 9:32 am

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People forge all sorts of financial instruments. Tungsten with gold plating? Computer hacking?
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by Dauntless   » Mon Oct 19, 2015 9:52 am

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wasn't there a para or two in torch of freedom about this.

during the BSC's sting op on parmley station there was a paragraph or two about a box which had the money in and how it had to handled carefully as if fake money went in then the depostiee could have their hand taken off.
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by Jonathan_S   » Mon Oct 19, 2015 10:23 am

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Dauntless wrote:wasn't there a para or two in torch of freedom about this.

during the BSC's sting op on parmley station there was a paragraph or two about a box which had the money in and how it had to handled carefully as if fake money went in then the depostiee could have their hand taken off.

Ah, now that you mention it I seem to remember something about that - though it may not have been in ToF.

What I did find in ToF was
Torch of Freedom: Ch 40 wrote:Jurgen Dusek had been a knee-breaker, a contract killer, a pimp, a drug dealer, a counterfeiter (of welfare chits, not money; nobody in their right mind tried to pass fake money on Mesa)


Ah, I took a little longer and I did find the scene that I think we were both thinking of. But it didn't have any specific mention of counterfeiting.
Torch of Freedom: Ch 10 wrote:Normal electronic fund transfers were entirely out of the question for an illegal transaction like this one. Despite all the ingenuity and sophistication of the current generation's practitioners of the ancient art of "money laundering," normal fund transfers left too many electronic footprints for anyone to be comfortable about. Besides, slavers—like smugglers and pirates—were not natively trusting souls.
Fortunately, it wasn't always possible to rely on normal electronic transfers, even when both parties to the transfers in question were as pure as the new fallen snow. Which was why physical fund transfers were still possible. As the female crewmember stepped forward, Hutchins punched in the combination to unlock the battle steel box, and its lid slid smoothly upward. Inside were several dozen credit chips, issued by the Banco de Madrid of Old Earth. Each of those chips was a wafer of molecular circuitry embedded inside a matrix of virtually indestructible plastic. That wafer contained a bank validation code, a numerical value, and a security key (whose security was probably better protected than the Solarian League Navy's central computer command codes), and any attempt to change the value programmed into it when it was originally issued would trigger the security code and turn it into a useless, fused lump. Those chips were recognized as legal tender anywhere in the explored galaxy, but there was no way for anyone to track where they'd gone, or—best of all from the slavers' perspective—whose hands they'd passed through, since the day they'd been issued by the Banco de Madrid.
The crewwoman didn't actually reach for the credit chips, of course. That sort of thing simply wasn't done. Besides, she knew as well as Hutchins did that if she'd been foolish enough to insert her hand into that box, the automatically descending lid would have removed it quite messily. Instead, she produced a small hand unit, aimed it in the direction of the chips, and studied the readout. She gazed at it for a moment, making certain that the amount on the readout matched the one Hutchins' superiors had agreed to, then nodded.
"Looks good," she said, and held out her hand.

You'd obviously need the very well protected security key in order to forge cryptographically protected credit chits (or find a crypto "break" in what is presumably a very well studied algorithm) - but it's certainly not impossible for someone with access to a Bank's cryptography credit-creation key to be turned or pressured into copying it.
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Mon Oct 19, 2015 10:30 am

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kzt wrote:People forge all sorts of financial instruments. Tungsten with gold plating? Computer hacking?

You're in the wrong business. You should be a security consultant. You hit that nail squarely on the head.

http://thehackernews.com/2014/05/pre-pl ... p-and.html

http://www.wired.com/2014/11/chip-n-pin ... erability/

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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