Honor's grandparent(s)

Even if they are aware and are opposed to the alignment or at least are not plotting to do something bad, there is nothing for the cats to detect. Being alpha line by itself if not detectable.

Judging from your last post, we are not in disagreement.

Don

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n7axw wrote:Even if they are aware and are opposed to the alignment or at least are not plotting to do something bad, there is nothing for the cats to detect. Being alpha line by itself if not detectable.

Judging from your last post, we are not in disagreement.

Don

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If they are not disciples of the Detweiler plan are they really starlines? My point is that the key element is their being a follower of that belief or a potential recruit. Anything else is persecution of the innocent. Aka who cares?

Mental masturbation

BrightSoul wrote:

n7axw wrote:Even if they are aware and are opposed to the alignment or at least are not plotting to do something bad, there is nothing for the cats to detect. Being alpha line by itself if not detectable.

Judging from your last post, we are not in disagreement.

Don

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If they are not disciples of the Detweiler plan are they really starlines? My point is that the key element is their being a follower of that belief or a potential recruit. Anything else is persecution of the innocent. Aka who cares?

A star line is biology: it's a line that the Long Range Planning Board is actively working on enhancing. Has nothing to do with whether the person involved is involved with the Alignment to some degree.

On 2011-6-17 RFC wrote:The other thing I’ll say is that the Alignment has lost a LOT of its “sleeper” lines over the centuries. It always assumed that it would lose quite a few of them and based its plans on letting a line go (and having redundant backups in place) rather than risking exposure by trying to “salvage” or hang onto one when there was no suitable generational candidate or there was a communications failure.They have also resorted to assassination in more than one instance to tie off potential loose ends. In the case of the Renaissance Factor’s leadership cadres, the “sleepers” are not individual family lines but of groups of allied families, and “the onion” is replicated within those families.

It's within the bounds of possibility that Manpower decided to seed Manticore with some sleepers because of the junction. In fact, it would be highly likely. Why they would use a family on Sphinx, which is way outside of the power center, is a lot less comprehensible.

BrightSoul wrote:

n7axw wrote:Even if they are aware and are opposed to the alignment or at least are not plotting to do something bad, there is nothing for the cats to detect. Being alpha line by itself if not detectable.

Judging from your last post, we are not in disagreement.

Don

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If they are not disciples of the Detweiler plan are they really starlines? My point is that the key element is their being a follower of that belief or a potential recruit. Anything else is persecution of the innocent. Aka who cares?

In Ashes of Victory, Allison spends time discussing the Meyerdahl Beta mods. It is clear she knew who did them. She also notes that for every improvement something else often had to give. She focused on intelligence, actually said evolution often did not move forward.

There seems little doubt that the mod was not based on Detweiler principles and that she knew how it had been made.

Go back to the text. And there were constant mods being done, probably almost all right under the Beowulf Compact. Chances are the envelope was pushed at times but no one claimed they were directly changing the species.

Had the Detweilers worked quietly and NOT announced wholesale changes, they might have progressed far better.


A star line is biology: it's a line that the Long Range Planning Board is actively working on enhancing. Has nothing to do with whether the person involved is involved with the Alignment to some degree.

On 2011-6-17 RFC wrote:The other thing I’ll say is that the Alignment has lost a LOT of its “sleeper” lines over the centuries. It always assumed that it would lose quite a few of them and based its plans on letting a line go (and having redundant backups in place) rather than risking exposure by trying to “salvage” or hang onto one when there was no suitable generational candidate or there was a communications failure.They have also resorted to assassination in more than one instance to tie off potential loose ends. In the case of the Renaissance Factor’s leadership cadres, the “sleepers” are not individual family lines but of groups of allied families, and “the onion” is replicated within those families.

It's within the bounds of possibility that Manpower decided to seed Manticore with some sleepers because of the junction. In fact, it would be highly likely. Why they would use a family on Sphinx, which is way outside of the power center, is a lot less comprehensible.[/quote]

Mesan star lines have a lot of genetic slave DNA in them as most of the new code gated into the star line is tested out in genetic slaves. Allison would have recognized the genetic slave genetic material at numerous points in Honor's childhood.

JohnRoth wrote:It's within the bounds of possibility that Manpower decided to seed Manticore with some sleepers because of the junction. In fact, it would be highly likely. Why they would use a family on Sphinx, which is way outside of the power center, is a lot less comprehensible.

we have textev that they did. The person in Manticore in the FO whose code key was compromised and used by Gisclaude to falsify the documents. And the dispatch that Bardassano mentioned to Albrecht about Zilwicki and Cachat visiting Honor on her flagship then disappearing, she mentioned since Descroix (?) "disappeared" her remaining source was much less advantageously placed and was lucky to get even a preliminary report on the dispatch queue.

pappilon wrote:

JohnRoth wrote:It's within the bounds of possibility that Manpower decided to seed Manticore with some sleepers because of the junction. In fact, it would be highly likely. Why they would use a family on Sphinx, which is way outside of the power center, is a lot less comprehensible.

we have textev that they did. The person in Manticore in the FO whose code key was compromised and used by Gisclaude to falsify the documents. And the dispatch that Bardassano mentioned to Albrecht about Zilwicki and Cachat visiting Honor on her flagship then disappearing, she mentioned since Descroix (?) "disappeared" her remaining source was much less advantageously placed and was lucky to get even a preliminary report on the dispatch queue.

We don't know that either of them were "sleeper" lines. They could very well have been ordinary traitors who were suborned for whatever reason.

JohnRoth wrote:

pappilon wrote:SNIP

we have textev that they did. The person in Manticore in the FO whose code key was compromised and used by Gisclaude to falsify the documents. And the dispatch that Bardassano mentioned to Albrecht about Zilwicki and Cachat visiting Honor on her flagship then disappearing, she mentioned since Descroix (?) "disappeared" her remaining source was much less advantageously placed and was lucky to get even a preliminary report on the dispatch queue.

We don't know that either of them were "sleeper" lines. They could very well have been ordinary traitors who were suborned for whatever reason.

IIRC a MAlign conversation where Albrect was checking that Descroix had been 'properly dispatched'...
[could be wrong though]

According to a friend the intelligence community has an acronym for intelligence assets and defectors. It's MICE

M Money

I Ideology

C Conscience

E Ego

Money is self explanatory Admiral Rajani 3.4 billion reasons.

Ideology is when someone believes in the cause or philosophy

Conscience is when you don't agree with the philosophy or action or activity done. Jack McBryde is an example of this

Ego I am better than my boss or bosses

kenl511 wrote:Mesan star lines have a lot of genetic slave DNA in them as most of the new code gated into the star line is tested out in genetic slaves. Allison would have recognized the genetic slave genetic material at numerous points in Honor's childhood.

Beyond that Star Lines are curated. The Harringtons proper have been in the Kingdom for over 400 years, and thus would not themselves be easily upgraded with the new changes.

Perhaps someone would think a group like the Harringtons with known mods would make a good cover to marry in. I think even that is debatable as Harringtons would be likely to be scanned to see if they have the mods, and if there's been some mutation.