Anti-pod 'spoiler' missile attacks

Jonathan_S wrote:

munroburton wrote:
Why not use the wedges of ordinary RDs to shred those pods? Mistletoe is designed for dealing with at least heavy cruiser sized units.

Because a recon drone ramming it's wedge into a towed pod that's only 4 - 5 hundred km behind a waller is a damned obvious target.

You probably aren't going to be able to run over more than a couple pods before someone in the wall pots you with a PDLC and ends your little rampage.


With mistletoe the big explosion gets all the pods within range and leaves nothing for the point defense to attack.


tl;dr - mistletoe's nuke should kill more pods than ramming would.

Should, yes, but that nuke still has to get close enough to catch those pods in its blast range - which certainly can't be measured in thousands of kilometres - and the drone is destroyed in the process. Sure, it's not likely drones operating that close to a modern wall of battle would be able to survive in any great numbers, but at least there's the possibility of getting more use out of them.

TBH, if I was asked to come up with a way to turn RDs into pod-killers, I'd try to mount countermissiles on them. Not many, but even two or four CMs per RD would really worry a CO stacking her pods. Heck, even a couple of pinnace-scale lasers would be enough to take out pods and wouldn't suck ammunition away from the rest of the fleet.

munroburton wrote:

Jonathan_S wrote:Because a recon drone ramming it's wedge into a towed pod that's only 4 - 5 hundred km behind a waller is a damned obvious target.

You probably aren't going to be able to run over more than a couple pods before someone in the wall pots you with a PDLC and ends your little rampage.


With mistletoe the big explosion gets all the pods within range and leaves nothing for the point defense to attack.


tl;dr - mistletoe's nuke should kill more pods than ramming would.

Should, yes, but that nuke still has to get close enough to catch those pods in its blast range - which certainly can't be measured in thousands of kilometres - and the drone is destroyed in the process. Sure, it's not likely drones operating that close to a modern wall of battle would be able to survive in any great numbers, but at least there's the possibility of getting more use out of them.

If I recall correctly, the standoff range for sidewall-burner nukes is described as thousands of kilometers. Presumably something that can take out a sidewall will also take out pods without sidewalls.

SWM wrote:If I recall correctly, the standoff range for sidewall-burner nukes is described as thousands of kilometers. Presumably something that can take out a sidewall will also take out pods without sidewalls.

Sidewall burners are also described as enormous warheads, which oddly enough matches the warheads used by mistletoe.

Batters UP:

On the left, standing at 30km wide, is RD wedge. Punching power is stealth, speed, wedge immune to PDLC. Glass jaw; dies to CM.

On the right, Mistletoe RD. Attack range is ??? No freaking idea! Assume grav focused nuke, gives a punch power of +1000km. See below.

Who is the ref? The referee is a whole passel of Pods. Amoeba man. The stripes on the shirt are spaced as close as half a kilometer or less stacked in 3d. Widest stripe on the refs shirt? Unknown. Tractors are good for what distance?

Who wins?

If the ref is wearing a close stripped shirt, then a single RD wedge should TKO the whole kaboodle with an opening round punch. What is the diameter/distance of EMP from Mistletoe? Unknown other than "it works". Effectively this is what shooting missiles at Pods behind a ship already are doing. We only know that the missile has to be a very definitive, "close" according to text.

Jonathan_S wrote:

munroburton wrote:
Why not use the wedges of ordinary RDs to shred those pods? Mistletoe is designed for dealing with at least heavy cruiser sized units.

Because a recon drone ramming it's wedge into a towed pod that's only 4 - 5 hundred km behind a waller is a damned obvious target.

You probably aren't going to be able to run over more than a couple pods before someone in the wall pots you with a PDLC and ends your little rampage.


With mistletoe the big explosion gets all the pods within range and leaves nothing for the point defense to attack.


tl;dr - mistletoe's nuke should kill more pods than ramming would.

J6P wrote:Batters UP:

On the left, standing at 30km wide, is RD wedge. Punching power is stealth, speed, wedge immune to PDLC. Glass jaw; dies to CM.

On the right, Mistletoe RD. Attack range is ??? No freaking idea! Assume grav focused nuke, gives a punch power of +1000km. See below.

Who is the ref? The referee is a whole passel of Pods. Amoeba man. The stripes on the shirt are spaced as close as half a kilometer or less stacked in 3d. Widest stripe on the refs shirt? Unknown. Tractors are good for what distance?

Who wins?

If the ref is wearing a close stripped shirt, then a single RD wedge should TKO the whole kaboodle with an opening round punch. What is the diameter/distance of EMP from Mistletoe? Unknown other than "it works". Effectively this is what shooting missiles at Pods behind a ship already are doing. We only know that the missile has to be a very definitive, "close" according to text.

Yes the RD wedge is immune to PDLC. But it's got no sidewalls, and it's flying around near a wall of battle. And PDLC shot from ahead, astern, or through the open sides of the wedge should stop it cold. It almost certainly can't roll wedge against every ship in the wall (and their escorts) simultaneously. That's one reason they form a wall; to generate interlocking fields of defensive fire.


I personally suspect and RD that close and that obvious is going to have a very short lifespan. But I could be wrong about that...

Sounds like a job for a next generation Lac . Small stealthy caft that can strike system defence pods before main fleet elements attack.
And sneaking quitely up behind a podnaught for a shot up the kilts.
A job for some real brave people indeed.

floss wrote:Sounds like a job for a next generation Lac . Small stealthy caft that can strike system defence pods before main fleet elements attack.
And sneaking quitely up behind a podnaught for a shot up the kilts.
A job for some real brave people indeed.

The problem with that will locating the pods. They don't emit a gravitic signature, they don't have any active sensors and they're generally made to be as stealthy as possible, so picking them up will likely require active radar/lidar sweeps, which will probably alert the defenders.

Dafmeister wrote:

floss wrote:Sounds like a job for a next generation Lac . Small stealthy caft that can strike system defence pods before main fleet elements attack.
And sneaking quitely up behind a podnaught for a shot up the kilts.
A job for some real brave people indeed.

The problem with that will locating the pods. They don't emit a gravitic signature, they don't have any active sensors and they're generally made to be as stealthy as possible, so picking them up will likely require active radar/lidar sweeps, which will probably alert the defenders.

True but there is ways to do a scan without revealing positions a large nuclear explosion would emit radio waves through a system for instance.(mining accident )

floss wrote:

Dafmeister wrote:The problem with that will locating the pods. They don't emit a gravitic signature, they don't have any active sensors and they're generally made to be as stealthy as possible, so picking them up will likely require active radar/lidar sweeps, which will probably alert the defenders.

True but there is ways to do a scan without revealing positions a large nuclear explosion would emit radio waves through a system for instance.(mining accident )

Not really. It would have to be an earth-shattering explosion to produced useful radiation over a large enough area to detect system defense pods.

The system defense pods are even more stealthy than the LACs you are suggesting find them. If it were possible for the LACs to find the pods, then it would be even easier for the system defenses to detect the LACs.