Solarian Military Catchup Attempts

Armed Neo-Bob wrote:

Zakharra wrote:The Malign is probably wishing they had been researching ways to shut down wormhole junctions. Remove that and the SEM becomes much less of a threat. I wonder what would happen if you overloaded a warshaski(?) sail in a wormhole while transiting it?

Nothing. you would have some minor debris which the wormhole itself would crush to dust in short order. The wormholes are areas in which enormously strong grav waves impinge on normal space.

Trying to shut down a grav wave with any human built construct won't happen. I suspect the author will tell you it would take the collapse of the star.

Rob

And the Fifth Imperium is unlikely to ally with the MA.

Zakharra wrote:The Malign is probably wishing they had been researching ways to shut down wormhole junctions. Remove that and the SEM becomes much less of a threat. I wonder what would happen if you overloaded a warshaski(?) sail in a wormhole while transiting it?

Armed Neo-Bob wrote:Nothing. you would have some minor debris which the wormhole itself would crush to dust in short order. The wormholes are areas in which enormously strong grav waves impinge on normal space.

Trying to shut down a grav wave with any human built construct won't happen. I suspect the author will tell you it would take the collapse of the star.

Rob

JeffEngel wrote:And the Fifth Imperium is unlikely to ally with the MA.

I was deliberately avoiding mentioning Dahak. But in this case Zakhara was forgetting that RFC has described the region of the junction as being light-seconds across. Quite aside from the energy involved, there is the sheer amount of area. It wouldn't be like a crazy bomber taking out a subway somewhere, or one of those under-the-river highway tunnels at the end of I90 that take you into Logan Airport in Boston.

Rob

Hi Valen123456,

If I haven't welcomed you to the forums already and offered your favorite CG beverage, I apologise; I'm definitely looking forward to more of your posts.

Congratulations on an excellent analysis!

My only nit is Eloise and Elisabeth et all are expecting a front organization that will have impeccable anti-slavery/Manpower credentials, since the end of MoH and all the repeated chapters since.

So when the RF shows up, the GA will be waiting and watching very carefully.

L

Valen123456 wrote:

SNIPPED 4 BREVITY

The problem the Alignment now faces is that they have been outed too thoroughly and too soon for their own still highly intricate plans. The formation of the Grand Alliance, the massive tech boosts their own engineered wars have given their opponents, and the rushed Oyster Bay have all given their opponents a serious grudge and a viable enough target for them to rally against. Yes the GA does not know about the Factor, but once it forms and starts quickly absorbing other systems, how long is it going to take before the GA figure out the Alignment are the puppet masters behind it, and then devote all their energies toward stopping it?

SNIPPED ETC

Hi Valen123456,

If I haven't welcomed you to the forums already and offered your favorite CG beverage, I apologise; I'm definitely looking forward to more of your posts.

Congratulations on an excellent analysis!

My only nit is Eloise and Elisabeth et all are expecting a front organization that will have impeccable anti-slavery/Manpower credentials, since the end of MoH and all the repeated chapters since.

So when the RF shows up, the GA will be waiting and watching very carefully.

L

Thanks for the belated welcome though I don't think I will ever match your post numbers.

Agreed on the little nit ... truth be told my impression is that the Alignment has so well hidden itself or is in such a position to manipulate public opinion or just withdraw back into the shadows, that it will be hard pressed to be defeated in any professional sense.

The best method I can think of is that someone will get their hands on some way of identifying the Alignments Alpha lines, that way they can decapitate all the Alignment carefully positioned sleeper lines and new politicos causing the Factor to fall apart. Or alternatively the Factor fails to achieve its goals because the plan has been too badly scuppered already (as i have stated elsewhere) forcing them to move more openly and so make mistakes.

Anyway, this thread is more about the Leagues methods for trying to come up with ideas/methods to close the gap with Manticore ... not that anyone on this forum actually expects anything in the future to save the League as it is now.

Valen123456 wrote:

Hi Valen123456,

If I haven't welcomed you to the forums already and offered your favorite CG beverage, I apologise; I'm definitely looking forward to more of your posts.

Congratulations on an excellent analysis!

My only nit is Eloise and Elisabeth et all are expecting a front organization that will have impeccable anti-slavery/Manpower credentials, since the end of MoH and all the repeated chapters since.

So when the RF shows up, the GA will be waiting and watching very carefully.

L

Thanks for the belated welcome though I don't think I will ever match your post numbers.

Agreed on the little nit ... truth be told my impression is that the Alignment has so well hidden itself or is in such a position to manipulate public opinion or just withdraw back into the shadows, that it will be hard pressed to be defeated in any professional sense.

The best method I can think of is that someone will get their hands on some way of identifying the Alignments Alpha lines, that way they can decapitate all the Alignment carefully positioned sleeper lines and new politicos causing the Factor to fall apart. Or alternatively the Factor fails to achieve its goals because the plan has been too badly scuppered already (as i have stated elsewhere) forcing them to move more openly and so make mistakes.

Anyway, this thread is more about the Leagues methods for trying to come up with ideas/methods to close the gap with Manticore ... not that anyone on this forum actually expects anything in the future to save the League as it is now.

The Alignment worlds might also, one at a time, simply announce their support of Manticore and the Grand Alliance against the tragically misled forces of the Solarian League, and then choose to spend another 2000 years setting up Plan B.

phillies wrote:The Alignment worlds might also, one at a time, simply announce their support of Manticore and the Grand Alliance against the tragically misled forces of the Solarian League, and then choose to spend another 2000 years setting up Plan B.

Agreed that is what they SHOULD do if they want to survive to ensure a renewed version of their great master plan is thought up and carried out. The situation is now likely to change to quickly for them to keep up with.

But can you really see the Deitweilers and their fellow supermen being willing to jump back underground and delay launching their grand plan until they are dead and gone?

Valen123456 wrote:

phillies wrote:The Alignment worlds might also, one at a time, simply announce their support of Manticore and the Grand Alliance against the tragically misled forces of the Solarian League, and then choose to spend another 2000 years setting up Plan B.

Agreed that is what they SHOULD do if they want to survive to ensure a renewed version of their great master plan is thought up and carried out. The situation is now likely to change to quickly for them to keep up with.

But can you really see the Deitweilers and their fellow supermen being willing to jump back underground and delay launching their grand plan until they are dead and gone?

It would make for a really boring story if they did

fallsfromtrees wrote:It would make for a really boring story if they did

As opposed to those gripping space battles we have now, where one side casually mows down their helpless opponents?

kzt wrote:

fallsfromtrees wrote:It would make for a really boring story if they did

As opposed to those gripping space battles we have now, where one side casually mows down their helpless opponents?

What we are getting now is getting close to what RFC refers to a war porn, so no, not the gripping space battles we have now. But a story where one side does to ground as thoroughly as the MAlign has done so far, and then stays hidden for 2000 years, giving no indication that they are there, and so giving no clues as to how they might be found is going to make for a lack of story telling opportunities.

Hi Valen123456,

It sounds like you're proposing Victor and Allison team up to identify and snip out the RF leaders etc.

That might be a very interesting scenario for more stories about Victor, but Thandi might have some objections...

Regarding the failure of the original purpose of this thread, yup.

Almost 7 years ago IIRC, RFC stated the SL didn't have 5 years left then [still 1921 PD], which was the minimum to build an SDP, if they knew what an SDP was, which they don't.

I have yet to see any proposed SL tech improvement in the years since that will delay the inevitable a week or a month, in part because the SLN is still so clueless about both GA offensive and defensive capabilities, which are only going to expand enormously thanks to the increasing technical cooperation besides the industrial juggernaut being assembled.

Given Haven after almost 3 years of war has already reached war production levels that dwarf anything the SL could match in the next year or two at best before the shells switch sides [assuming such war production was left alone], NTM all the protectorates and the best of the old league, leaving the rump considerably outnumbered in industrial output; thus any planned interstellar production cooperation will be gutted, leaving systems increasingly dependent on themselves and possibly friendly neighbors, though RFC didn't hold out much hope for that.

Given BF being destroyed within a month or two of the attack on Beowulf [though it may take the mandarins longer to realize it], I expect most of the rest of the SL to abandon the SL quite quickly, as the news spreads.

Not only over the attack itself [confirmation of the mandarins ignoring the constitutional guarantees of independence etc], and the repeatedly demonstrated military incompetence, but the now demonstrated inability to stop the GA, which would terrify any helpless star system into making or being willing to make all sorts of concessions, which the GA probably wouldn't require, putting most systems far more at ease with the GA.

One of the major problems the Rf will have is demonstrating they could stop the GA if they had to; since they can't without at least the Lenny Det's, recruiting will not match MAlign targets for some time if ever.

Even if it takes 4 years for the SL to perfect an MDM, despite the fact the MA's higher tech hasn't done it yet in 8 years, if the SL lasts that long, the effective range of ~40 M km without Apollo won't compete with whatever Apollo's range is by then; 6&2/3 LM, 7 LM, 7.5 LM, 8LM, pick your own figure.

L

Valen123456 wrote:

Hi Valen123456,

If I haven't welcomed you to the forums already and offered your favorite CG beverage, I apologise; I'm definitely looking forward to more of your posts.

Congratulations on an excellent analysis!

My only nit is Eloise and Elisabeth et all are expecting a front organization that will have impeccable anti-slavery/Manpower credentials, since the end of MoH and all the repeated chapters since.

So when the RF shows up, the GA will be waiting and watching very carefully.

L

Thanks for the belated welcome though I don't think I will ever match your post numbers.

Agreed on the little nit ... truth be told my impression is that the Alignment has so well hidden itself or is in such a position to manipulate public opinion or just withdraw back into the shadows, that it will be hard pressed to be defeated in any professional sense.

The best method I can think of is that someone will get their hands on some way of identifying the Alignments Alpha lines, that way they can decapitate all the Alignment carefully positioned sleeper lines and new politicos causing the Factor to fall apart. Or alternatively the Factor fails to achieve its goals because the plan has been too badly scuppered already (as i have stated elsewhere) forcing them to move more openly and so make mistakes.

Anyway, this thread is more about the Leagues methods for trying to come up with ideas/methods to close the gap with Manticore ... not that anyone on this forum actually expects anything in the future to save the League as it is now.