Promotion for CWO Harkness

Also, hell will have frozen over and the Detweiler's will be hosted as guests of honor at a family gathering of the Harringtons and Benton-Ramirez y Chous.

Hey if any of them survive that might even happen in a few T-Centuries:P.

As someone else pointed out in this thread, Harkness has the PMV. This means almost every single officer in the RMN has to salute him first - the only other known living recipients are Honor Harrington and Aivars Terekhov, both now flag officers and on top of the pile anyway.

The sort of chap Sir Horace is, I suspect he enjoys the twist of himself not being a commissioned officer every time it happens.

And he'd also probably prefer to enlist in Marine boot camp rather than take an actual commission of his own. I think of him as a NCO/WO version of Captain Kirk - someone who never really took to higher rank despite being entirely capable of it.

That isn't to say it wouldn't happen in another few years or more, particularly if the RMN ends up pulling Harkness into BuShips/BuWeps.

Starsaber wrote:Nah, he'll probably get a "field commission" as an admiral a week before he retires for the pension. :p

I think we have a winner.

munroburton wrote:As someone else pointed out in this thread, Harkness has the PMV. This means almost every single officer in the RMN has to salute him first - the only other known living recipients are Honor Harrington and Aivars Terekhov, both now flag officers and on top of the pile anyway.

The sort of chap Sir Horace is, I suspect he enjoys the twist of himself not being a commissioned officer every time it happens.

And he'd also probably prefer to enlist in Marine boot camp rather than take an actual commission of his own. I think of him as a NCO/WO version of Captain Kirk - someone who never really took to higher rank despite being entirely capable of it.

That isn't to say it wouldn't happen in another few years or more, particularly if the RMN ends up pulling Harkness into BuShips/BuWeps.

Starsaber wrote:Nah, he'll probably get a "field commission" as an admiral a week before he retires for the pension. :p

I think we have a winner.

To be clear, for us civilians, what happens now with Honor and Horace, do they both salute?

cthia wrote:

munroburton wrote:As someone else pointed out in this thread, Harkness has the PMV. This means almost every single officer in the RMN has to salute him first - the only other known living recipients are Honor Harrington and Aivars Terekhov, both now flag officers and on top of the pile anyway.[snip]
To be clear, for us civilians, what happens now with Honor and Horace, do they both salute?

Not sure what the proper protocol is; but in practice when Honor and Harace run into each other there'd probably be some hearty back slapping then they'd head off in search of an Old Tillman and do a a bit of catching up

cthia wrote:To be clear, for us civilians, what happens now with Honor and Horace, do they both salute?

At the same time on the count of three. One...two....

Don

munroburton wrote:As someone else pointed out in this thread, Harkness has the PMV. This means almost every single officer in the RMN has to salute him first - the only other known living recipients are Honor Harrington and Aivars Terekhov, both now flag officers and on top of the pile anyway.[snip]

cthia wrote:To be clear, for us civilians, what happens now with Honor and Horace, do they both salute?

Johnathan_S wrote:Not sure what the proper protocol is; but in practice when Honor and Harace run into each other there'd probably be some hearty back slapping then they'd head off in search of an Old Tillman and do a a bit of catching up

It's hard to imagine Harkness ever failing to salute the "Old Lady."

Kytheros wrote:When Horace Harkness wants to be a commissioned officer, his records will show that he is a commissioned officer.

And BuPers records wouldn't lie, right?

Also, hell will have frozen over and the Detweiler's will be hosted as guests of honor at a family gathering of the Harringtons and Benton-Ramirez y Chous.[/quote]

Lets not forget a few treecats like Sorrow Singer and her brother.

cthia wrote:

munroburton wrote:As someone else pointed out in this thread, Harkness has the PMV. This means almost every single officer in the RMN has to salute him first - the only other known living recipients are Honor Harrington and Aivars Terekhov, both now flag officers and on top of the pile anyway.[snip]

cthia wrote:To be clear, for us civilians, what happens now with Honor and Horace, do they both salute?

Johnathan_S wrote:Not sure what the proper protocol is; but in practice when Honor and Harace run into each other there'd probably be some hearty back slapping then they'd head off in search of an Old Tillman and do a a bit of catching up

It's hard to imagine Harkness ever failing to salute the "Old Lady."

They both have the PMV = everybody without one salutes them first, and then salutes per rank go around if there are others around. I think.
I don't recall the wording we've gotten in text for the PMV, but I'm not sure they're required to salute anyone.
It may very well be something that is or was a gray area in the regs - after all, the PMV isn't the sort of thing that someone who's still alive gets very often, and the chances that more than one living recipient would be alive at the same time (especially pre-prolong) have to be pretty long odds.


If there is need to salute, I'd expect that it is either a simultaneous salute, or that Horace would salute Honor, as they both have the PMV, but without PMVs, he would be saluting her.
If there is not need to salute, I'd expect Horace might well (start to) give a salute to Honor out of reflex/respect/habit, but then Jonathan_S's prediction happens.

I'm beginning to think that the PMV demands Honor to salute. Being Honor, I'm sure she would be delighted to show Harkness the respect that he deserves and has earned also whilst giving due respect to the medal and for what it stands - especially in lieu of the fact that he is responsible for her being alive. Whether, or not, each salute would fail to bleed Harkness red, has my chips on the former.

I was hoping that there was a real life parallel. There is the US Army Medal of Honor.

7. Medal of Honor recipients have uniform privileges, which allow them to wear their uniforms at any time or place they choose, unlike other military personnel or retirees.

8. Although not required by law or military regulation, service members are encouraged to salute Medal of Honor recipients as a gesture of respect and courtesy regardless of rank or status and, if the recipients are wearing the medal, whether or not they are in uniform. This is the only instance where a Soldier will receive a salute from members of a higher rank.

*Where information about having privilege to wear their uniform at any time or place they choose reminds me of the incident with Janacek and White Haven about White Haven wearing his uniform in his presence while on half-pay. That couldn't happen to Sir Horace or Honor. Interesting as well.

*I forget the exact details of that.

http://armylive.dodlive.mil/index.php/2 ... ing-facts/

<snip>

Kytheros wrote:I don't recall the wording we've gotten in text for the PMV

<snip>

From "Ashes of Victory," chapter 10:

Harkness came to attention and started a salute, but Ashford's hand beat him to it. As was only fitting. Anyone who'd won the PMV was entitled to take a salute from anyone who hadn't, and that was one tradition for which the captain felt no resentment at all.

So, I guess that means everyone would salute both of them, and Harkness would salute Honor (who would be saluted by everyone except Caparelli anyhow).